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TylerK
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07-19-2005, 02:10 PM
Post subject: Small pocket pair, HU on river UI
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PEANUT BUTTER JELLY TIME
Posts: 1,791
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Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx
Preflop: Hero is UTG with 7 , 7 .
Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, 2 folds, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.
Flop: (6 SB) T, 4 , 6 (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, Button checks.
Turn: (3 BB) K (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds.
River: (5 BB) 4 (2 players)
Hero...?
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TylerK: its just gambling if i want to worry about money i'll go to work lol
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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normally, i wouldn't even put in the turn bet. as you played, i check/call the river. they won't fold a pair of tens or kings, but might bluff it on the end.
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juke0414
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 25
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You probably should have bet the flop, and you certainly shouldn't have open limped. I would pump the cheap street to see where I stand and play the turn accordingly. Your turn bet here was a bit of a post-oak bluff, and can't likely be corrected with a river bet. Check/calling is all I can see you doing at this point.
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"Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser." - The Great SU
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Nehmer
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Decatur, IL
Posts: 666
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by juke0414
You probably should have bet the flop, and you certainly shouldn't have open limped.
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I'm going to disagree on both of these points. I don't think there is anyway it's a good idea to bet a small pair on that flop in a 6-handed pot. Even if nobody has the 10, you are almost definately going to get 2-4 callers who have a very good chance of catching something on the turn. I also think that small/medium pairs from UTG or UTG+1 are one of the few situations where it is good to open limp. I know that I have had a lot of success with them in those situations so far.
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juke0414
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 25
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I would agree that neither are great plays. Given the circumstances, I would have folded 77 UTG. I don't open limp unless the ole KK-AA in early position on an aggressive table, which means in early position I only open with 8s or better. But how can you say that a turn bet here is better than a flop bet. The flop bet is cheaper and more aggressive, and betting against two overcards with the hopes of kicking out all 6 players seems strange. By the time the turn card fell I would have checked it, and probably check/folded. Maybe check/call, but I doubt it.
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"Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser." - The Great SU
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Nehmer
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Decatur, IL
Posts: 666
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by juke0414
I would agree that neither are great plays. Given the circumstances, I would have folded 77 UTG. I don't open limp unless the ole KK-AA in early position on an aggressive table, which means in early position I only open with 8s or better. But how can you say that a turn bet here is better than a flop bet. The flop bet is cheaper and more aggressive, and betting against two overcards with the hopes of kicking out all 6 players seems strange. By the time the turn card fell I would have checked it, and probably check/folded. Maybe check/call, but I doubt it.
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I never said that I thought the turn bet was good, only that a flop bet would be bad 
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TylerK
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PEANUT BUTTER JELLY TIME
Posts: 1,791
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My logic is that after the flop checked through, I probably had the best hand. The only draw the turn completes is a 3-out overcard draw, so it's a somewhat safe card. Iif it didn't hit anybody, I probably take the pot there.
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TylerK: its just gambling if i want to worry about money i'll go to work lol
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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Raise preflop, bet the flop, etc.
Your line: check/fold the turn.
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mike4066
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,943
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Check / fold the turn.
check /fold the river
But since you ended up where you did..
If you insist on betting the river, fold if you get re-raised.
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TylerK
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PEANUT BUTTER JELLY TIME
Posts: 1,791
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I guess I need more explanation on this one, because I don't really understand why I should bet the flop with a weak middle pair into 3 limpers or why I should check/fold the turn after the flop gets checked through.
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TylerK: its just gambling if i want to worry about money i'll go to work lol
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