Pot Odds Math in Hi/Lo games.

**Pelion** · 07-01-2007 12:18 AM

Ok I'm digging through a few PLO8 hands trying to get the hang of this game and Id like to check Ive got the math right.

Ok so heres a hand from earlier. I know I played it badly but Id like to stay focussed on the math rather than the hand for now. There will be plenty of other hands to teach me how to actually play

.
Poker Stars
Pot Limit Omaha Ring game
Blinds: $0.01/$0.02
7 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (7 players) Hero is SB with A

2

3

6

UTG calls, UTG+1 (poster) checks, MP1 calls, 2 folds, Hero raises to $0.08, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: 9

6

8

($0.28, 3 players)
Hero bets $0.16, UTG+1 folds, MP1 raises to $0.76, Hero raises to $1.36, MP1 calls all-in $0.12.
Uncalled bets: $0.48 returned to Hero.

Turn: K

($2.04, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $2.04)

River: J

($2.04, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $2.04)

Results:
Final pot: $2.04

Ok so when he makes his big raise Im assuming we're both committed if I call so Ill just treat it as a push.

So after he pushes theres effectively 132 in the pot. I have to call 72.

But I am only playing for half pot so I will win 66 when I win and I will also win half of my bet so 36.

So I have to call 72 to win 102 which is 1.4 to 1.

Twodimes tells me that

cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV
2c Ad 6h 3h 17 17 803 0 610 0 0 0.383
Ks Ac 9d 9h 209 803 17 0 0 0 0 0.617

So I need 617/383:1 = 1.6:1.

I dont got it so I fold right?

Is there a way to put ranges in twodimes calculator rather than individual hands? If not is there another program/website anyone can recommend. Sorry for the long post but this is something pretty fundamental that I need to get down.

**overflow** · 07-01-2007 01:13 AM

You've got a naked low draw with almost no chance at the high (running 6's, running A's) why the hell are you felting it here?

**Pelion** · 07-01-2007 01:27 AM

Im aware I played it pretty horribly. Im more interested in if im doing the maths right.

**swiggidy** · 07-05-2007 02:23 PM

You are risking 72 to win 1/2 of 132 which is 66. You don't "win" the money in your hand.

So, 72 : 66 => 1 : 0.92 (or 1.09 : 1), but since you are so far off it's an easy fold.

There are no Omaha calculators that do ranges that I'm aware of. Try a couple different types of hands to see where you stand

**Pelion** · 07-05-2007 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by swiggidy

You are risking 72 to win 1/2 of 132 which is 66. You don't "win" the money in your hand.

No you are right... but when I win I only get back half of my bet so I guess i have to subtract that from my half of the pot?

**swiggidy** · 07-05-2007 05:20 PM

hmmm, yeah

So, when we win, we get 66 - 36 = 30

**zenbitz** · 07-05-2007 10:16 PM

When he raises you the pot is effectively $0.44 = the dead money already there. Everything else is 1:1 and since we are writing off your chance to scoop you are basically laying $1.36:$1.58 (1.58 = rest of your stack + 0.22). Which is like 1.17:1.

I think we can write off your chance to scoop since there is also a chance you are quartered.

**salsa4ever** · 07-08-2007 06:27 PM

2.04 x 0.383 = 0.77

u need to call 0.72

so it's a call

u are confusing the actual equity with the chance of "winnng" low

you were actually kind of close. what you were missing is that your chance of making low is actually 72%

twodimes has already discounted for the fact u win only half

zenbitz had the right thinking ut forgot that hero's effective stack was less than his actual stack of 1.36

you are also possibly beating an A2xx or can improve to quarter or scoop him. Therefore, I would call.

Without the pair of 6s I would fold

**zenbitz** · 07-09-2007 07:36 PM

Ah, I misread the converter. He bet 0.16 then puts the rest in, effective stack only $1.20 after the raise.

**jtleon** · 07-09-2007 08:15 PM

i dont get it.
the pot is 0.28 on flop
with hero bet 0.16, there should be only 0.44 in the pot
this is pot limit omaha8, how could the MP1 raise to 0.76 to the pot of 0.44?

**Pelion** · 07-10-2007 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by jtleon

i dont get it.
the pot is 0.28 on flop
with hero bet 0.16, there should be only 0.44 in the pot
this is pot limit omaha8, how could the MP1 raise to 0.76 to the pot of 0.44?

the pot is 0.28. After my 0.16 bet it is 0.44. If he calls my bet the pot will be 0.60 so a pot sized raise is an extra 0.60. In other words 76c.

**Pelion** · 07-10-2007 04:33 PM

Salsa, thanks for clearing up the maths there. Also are you saying I played it well? I actually thought it was quite bad against a likely range.

**salsa4ever** · 07-12-2007 11:12 AM

yes

played well. sometimes with short stacks you just get quartered. even the best players in the world will get quartered sometimes. you'd be surprised how often your pair of 6s wins you the high if the other player has also nut low

07-01-2007 12:18 AM #1
Pelion View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 4,563	Pot Odds Math in Hi/Lo games. Ok I'm digging through a few PLO8 hands trying to get the hang of this game and Id like to check Ive got the math right. Ok so heres a hand from earlier. I know I played it badly but Id like to stay focussed on the math rather than the hand for now. There will be plenty of other hands to teach me how to actually play . Poker Stars Pot Limit Omaha Ring game Blinds: $0.01/$0.02 7 players Converter Pre-flop: (7 players) Hero is SB with A 2 3 6 UTG calls, UTG+1 (poster) checks, MP1 calls, 2 folds, Hero raises to $0.08, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls. Flop: 9 6 8 ($0.28, 3 players) Hero bets $0.16, UTG+1 folds, MP1 raises to $0.76, Hero raises to $1.36, MP1 calls all-in $0.12. Uncalled bets: $0.48 returned to Hero. Turn: K ($2.04, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $2.04) River: J ($2.04, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $2.04) Results: Final pot: $2.04 Ok so when he makes his big raise Im assuming we're both committed if I call so Ill just treat it as a push. So after he pushes theres effectively 132 in the pot. I have to call 72. But I am only playing for half pot so I will win 66 when I win and I will also win half of my bet so 36. So I have to call 72 to win 102 which is 1.4 to 1. Twodimes tells me that cards scoop HIwin HIlos HItie LOwin LOlos LOtie EV 2c Ad 6h 3h 17 17 803 0 610 0 0 0.383 Ks Ac 9d 9h 209 803 17 0 0 0 0 0.617 So I need 617/383:1 = 1.6:1. I dont got it so I fold right? Is there a way to put ranges in twodimes calculator rather than individual hands? If not is there another program/website anyone can recommend. Sorry for the long post but this is something pretty fundamental that I need to get down.
	gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days. bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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07-01-2007 01:13 AM #2
overflow View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date May 2007 Posts 354	You've got a naked low draw with almost no chance at the high (running 6's, running A's) why the hell are you felting it here?

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07-01-2007 01:27 AM #3
Pelion View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 4,563	Im aware I played it pretty horribly. Im more interested in if im doing the maths right.
	gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days. bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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07-05-2007 02:23 PM #4
swiggidy View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 7,809 Location Waiting in the shadows ...	You are risking 72 to win 1/2 of 132 which is 66. You don't "win" the money in your hand. So, 72 : 66 => 1 : 0.92 (or 1.09 : 1), but since you are so far off it's an easy fold. There are no Omaha calculators that do ranges that I'm aware of. Try a couple different types of hands to see where you stand
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07-05-2007 03:16 PM #5
Pelion View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 4,563	Originally Posted by swiggidy You are risking 72 to win 1/2 of 132 which is 66. You don't "win" the money in your hand. No you are right... but when I win I only get back half of my bet so I guess i have to subtract that from my half of the pot?
	gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days. bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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Pot Odds Math in Hi/Lo games.

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Pot Odds Math in Hi/Lo games.

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07-05-2007 05:20 PM #6
swiggidy View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 7,809 Location Waiting in the shadows ...	hmmm, yeah So, when we win, we get 66 - 36 = 30
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07-05-2007 10:16 PM #7
zenbitz View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jul 2004 Posts 2,859	When he raises you the pot is effectively $0.44 = the dead money already there. Everything else is 1:1 and since we are writing off your chance to scoop you are basically laying $1.36:$1.58 (1.58 = rest of your stack + 0.22). Which is like 1.17:1. I think we can write off your chance to scoop since there is also a chance you are quartered.

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07-08-2007 06:27 PM #8
salsa4ever View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jun 2005 Posts 1,363 Location Melbourne	Re: Pot Odds Math in Hi/Lo games. 2.04 x 0.383 = 0.77 u need to call 0.72 so it's a call u are confusing the actual equity with the chance of "winnng" low you were actually kind of close. what you were missing is that your chance of making low is actually 72% twodimes has already discounted for the fact u win only half zenbitz had the right thinking ut forgot that hero's effective stack was less than his actual stack of 1.36 you are also possibly beating an A2xx or can improve to quarter or scoop him. Therefore, I would call. Without the pair of 6s I would fold
	Originally Posted by bigred Would you bone your cousins? Salsa would. Originally Posted by salsa4ever well courtie, since we're both clear, would you accept an invitation for some unprotected sex?
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07-09-2007 07:36 PM #9
zenbitz View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jul 2004 Posts 2,859	Ah, I misread the converter. He bet 0.16 then puts the rest in, effective stack only $1.20 after the raise.

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07-09-2007 08:15 PM #10
jtleon View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Apr 2007 Posts 23	i dont get it. the pot is 0.28 on flop with hero bet 0.16, there should be only 0.44 in the pot this is pot limit omaha8, how could the MP1 raise to 0.76 to the pot of 0.44?

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07-10-2007 04:31 PM #11
Pelion View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 4,563	Originally Posted by jtleon i dont get it. the pot is 0.28 on flop with hero bet 0.16, there should be only 0.44 in the pot this is pot limit omaha8, how could the MP1 raise to 0.76 to the pot of 0.44? the pot is 0.28. After my 0.16 bet it is 0.44. If he calls my bet the pot will be 0.60 so a pot sized raise is an extra 0.60. In other words 76c.
	gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days. bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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07-10-2007 04:33 PM #12
Pelion View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 4,563	Salsa, thanks for clearing up the maths there. Also are you saying I played it well? I actually thought it was quite bad against a likely range.
	gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days. bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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07-12-2007 11:12 AM #13
salsa4ever View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jun 2005 Posts 1,363 Location Melbourne	yes played well. sometimes with short stacks you just get quartered. even the best players in the world will get quartered sometimes. you'd be surprised how often your pair of 6s wins you the high if the other player has also nut low
	Originally Posted by bigred Would you bone your cousins? Salsa would. Originally Posted by salsa4ever well courtie, since we're both clear, would you accept an invitation for some unprotected sex?
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