|
mb2447
|
11-17-2005, 03:56 AM
Post subject: open-raising
|
#1 (permalink)
|
|
Straight
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 122
|
|
Is it a good idea? A mandate? Somewhere in between, depending?
I forget where I read it, but somewhere along the line I picked up the notion that open-limping, especially in MP or LP, is the worst worst worst thing ever. I remembered this recently and started to open-raise quite a bit more, but I haven't been doing it long enough to analyze the results.
So, is this a good idea? Clearly it's not smart to open-raise with any 2 cards, but with QJ, K10, other modest but playable hands, I feel that this is a profitable tactic.
Thoughts?
|
|
|
Play for FREE and practice your game at...
Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
|
|
Demiparadigm
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
|
|
I raise approximately everything I decide to open with.
If its not worth a raise, its probably not worth playing.
|
|
To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.
|
|
thenonsequitur
|
|
11-17-2005, 01:44 PM
Post subject: Re: open-raising
|
#3 (permalink)
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Location: Location
Posts: 637
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by mb2447
Clearly it's not smart to open-raise with any 2 cards
|
When I first started playing this sort of thought made me doubt the concept that I should be open-raising almost any hand I play. My logic started with the concept of "these are the cards I should be playing given the looseness of the table" and then deciding from there on a hand-by-hand basis (of playable cards) when I should be calling and when I should be raising.
Then when I realized that I was way too loose passive I decided to reverse the logic. I started with the concept of "open-raise with any cards you play" and then deciding from there on a hand-by-hand basis when I should be playing (and hence raising) and when I should be folding. I simply diciplined myself and did not allow myself to open-limp with anything. If I didn't feel comfortable raising, I folded.
This had a nice side-effect of cutting out a lot of the crap that I used to be limping with, as well as learning to make +EV marginal raises that I used to be calling with. And it generally put me in less difficult situations post-flop (fewer players, more well-defined opposition, pocket cards are better = decisions are usually more clear). Later on I decided that in certain situations (especially in EP) and certain table conditions (especially very loose tables) open-limping can be correct, but it is really a lot more infrequently a good idea than it seems.
|
|
|
|
Ltrain
|
|
Flush
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Miami, Florida
Posts: 514
|
|
I agree with thenonsequitur and my view on open raising is very similar.
As my game has evolved, my default is to open raise or fold, but I will open limp suited connectors or A,low suited in early position occasionally on a loose, passive table averaging about 8xBB pots and less than 5% PFR. These hands can be playable even if you happen to get raised. I won't however open limp non-suited broadway cards from any position; not raising these is asking for trouble.
|
|
"Don't judge a man until you have walked a mile in his shoes. Then you are a mile away, and have his shoes." - Anon.
|
|
euphoricism
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Your place or my place
Posts: 3,610
|
|
This concept is vital once you get to about 3/6. If youre open limping, youre losing.
|
|
|
|
Ayodeji13
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 35
|
|
In low limit/micro limit i think that the value of openraising is generally depreciated, though I will raise the majority of hands i play, I generally will not raise w/ suited connectors, pairs below 9ish out of position, Axs, etc...
on the flip side .... in lower limit i have lower reraise standards... so i will oftern reraise to isolate with hands like AJs, AQo, etc... but then again i have pokertracker so i only do that against maniacs, and other types that are aggresive preflop
|
|
|
|
Hate
|
|
Flush
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 322
|
|
I've often won the blinds at .5/1 by openrasing a JTo or A8o from MP. Anything I play from MP onwards, I openraise. I sometimes opencall just from UTG with sth like 77-99, although I sometimes openraise 99 from there. Also, and Ax (x>7) suited from UTG on a very LP table.
|
|
|
|
koolmoe
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
|
|
Whether to open raise marginal hands from EP depends a lot on table texture and how well your hand plays multiway. Obviously, premium hands you can and should raise from anywhere (unless you are trying a limp-reraise).
If the table is loose, with a lot of multi-way pots and frequent cold-callers, I think you are better off limping (or folding) marginal hands that will need to connect with the flop to win.
If the table is tight, you can raise marginal hands that play well HU or 3-way in hopes of thinning the field. Getting three bet there sucks, but not as bad as getting isolation raised by a weak hand with position. Most opponents won't three bet without a relatively strong hand, but will isolation raise with a much wider range, some of which will be worse than your holding.
From MP or LP, I generally raise any time it is folded to me and my hand is worth playing (i.e., raise or fold) because the odds of playing against a small field are much greater and the odds of a better hand behind you are much worse.
|
|
Poker is freedom
|
|
thenonsequitur
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Location: Location
Posts: 637
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by euphoricism
This concept is vital once you get to about 3/6. If youre open limping, youre losing.
|
I'd like to add that this concept is also vital in 6-max, at any stakes.
|
|
|
|
euphoricism
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Your place or my place
Posts: 3,610
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by thenonsequitur
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by euphoricism
This concept is vital once you get to about 3/6. If youre open limping, youre losing.
|
I'd like to add that this concept is also vital in 6-max, at any stakes. |
Well, yes, but I figured that was implied :]
|
|
|
|
nemofromuscl
|
|
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 46
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Hate
I've often won the blinds at .5/1 by openrasing a JTo or A8o from MP. Anything I play from MP onwards, I openraise. I sometimes opencall just from UTG with sth like 77-99, although I sometimes openraise 99 from there. Also, and Ax (x>7) suited from UTG on a very LP table.
|
I often have trouble with hands in EP, playing the games I do (.5-1 and 1/2) because when I raise out of the position and get more than 1 or 2 callers, and don't hit the flop I wont know what to do- If I keep betting Ill often get called down with top pair (If I have QQ and and A flops - called down with ax not willing to raise) or called down by 89 if Im raising AK to a flop of 259 or something. If I give up and check on the river, people are more inclined to bluff with nothing or bet with thier cards that beat me. I have started to limp from EP in the looser games but become much more aggresive when I have position. Is this okay? I am just waiting to get to play the higher games with tighter tables, I don't like dealing with this.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
In 15c/30c it's ok to open limp since if you open limp five players limp and when you raise the half the table calls.
|
|
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Pусский
Svenska
05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
Linear Mode
