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Omaha Equity Quiz

  
 
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bigspenda73
Old 08-17-2008, 01:08 AM     Post subject: Omaha Equity Quiz #1 (permalink)  
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 I feel like a huge key in beating PLO is understanding your equity against certain hands. Many times when we feel like we have 50/50 type hands we do not, also, a lot of time when our draws feel weakish we have a lot more equity than we believe and could benefit from playing them a bit faster.

Here's what you do. Take 15 seconds MAXIMUM on each example (just like in real-time) and jot down your equity in the pot. I'll do the same and post my answers in the next post. I'll then run the results after we have some responses.


Hand 1

Hero: :Ah: :Jh:
Villain: :Tc: :Td:

Flop :Th:


Hand 2

Hero: :Kc: :Qc: :Jd:
Villain: :Ac: :Ah: :Th:

Flop :Jc: :Tc:

Hand 3

Hero: :Th: :Tc:
Villain: :Ah: :Ad: :Jd: :Kh:

Flop :Jh: :Qh:
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bigspenda73
Old 08-17-2008, 01:12 AM #2 (permalink)  
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 Alright my immediate thoughts, remember this is 15-20 seconds time:

Hand 1
Hero has 40% equity

Hand 2
Hero has 44% equity

Hand 3
Hero has 27% equity
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drmcboy
Old 08-17-2008, 03:49 AM #3 (permalink)  
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 quick with 4 tables too
Hero has:
30

40

35
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overflow
Old 08-17-2008, 08:31 AM #4 (permalink)  
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Hero has:

1) 38%
2) 45%
3) 27%
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bigspenda73
Old 08-17-2008, 03:15 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmcboy
quick with 4 tables too
Hero has:
30

40

35
Can you explain to me how you got 35% for hand 3 please.
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Old 08-17-2008, 04:36 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I don't play Omaha yet, so I took maybe a minute on each and came up with:

h1: 56%
h2: 32%
h3: 25%

but in hand 1 I forgot to minus out the redraw so a real figure would be something like 37%
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bigspenda73
Old 08-17-2008, 05:48 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iopq
I don't play Omaha yet
hey, nobody's perfect
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drmcboy
Old 08-17-2008, 06:13 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
Originally Posted by drmcboy
quick with 4 tables too
Hero has:
30

40

35
Can you explain to me how you got 35% for hand 3 please.
Quote:
Take 15 seconds MAXIMUM on each example
lolyoutarped me. good job
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bigspenda73
Old 08-17-2008, 07:30 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmcboy
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigspenda73
Quote:
Originally Posted by drmcboy
quick with 4 tables too
Hero has:
30

40

35
Can you explain to me how you got 35% for hand 3 please.
Quote:
Take 15 seconds MAXIMUM on each example
lolyoutarped me. good job
Not sure exactly what you mean, you were closer to the right answer than the other 3, I'm trying to determine what I'm missing.
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drmcboy
Old 08-17-2008, 08:15 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 explaining how I got the answer requires much more than 15 seconds! I guess at the glance it looked like we had cleaner outs but now I've thought about it waaay more than 15 seconds.

I have def been thinking (hoping?) in a general sense before the river this game is more about your cards than theirs because between all the cards and duplication and free rolling and how people over play sets I'm mostly just making big hands and putting money in.

On the river there are some good spots vs good players to bluff but I never seen to be on the river vs good players without a monster anyway
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TLR
Old 08-18-2008, 04:37 AM #11 (permalink)  
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 Quick glance

1. About 40%
2. 45%
3. 30%


 
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bigspenda73
Old 08-18-2008, 04:43 AM #12 (permalink)  
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 Actual Results:

Hand 1: 33.78%

Hand 2: 49.76%

Hand 3: 33.78%

So hands 1 and 3 are the exact same equity and hand 2 has a lot more than I thought at first glance.

Basically this is how I try to calculate equity, I determine hero's equity w/o taking villains redraws into account, then I determine villains redraws.

So like to me, if we have 15 outs twice we have 60% and if our opponent has a 6-7 out redraw we have to cut our equity by 25% so 60% becomes 45%.

How does everyone else do this at the table?
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TLR
Old 08-18-2008, 05:12 AM #13 (permalink)  
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TLR is an unknown quantity at this point
 When you count outs you have to take into account that above 10 outs the 4% per card formula starts to break, decrease 1 out for outs above 10 and 2 outs for outs over 16 and you will be closer.

Redraw calculation is a bit more complex then you presented, since the redraws depends on the out you hit.

Te 2nd hand is a good example

Your live outs are:
2xA
3xK
3xQ
3xJ
3x9
3x8

So total of 17 outs or about 60%

However assuming you hit your card on the turn villian outs are as following
You hit 2xA: 6 clubs + 8 cards to pair the board = 14
3xK - villian has 9 outs
3xQ - 9 outs
3xJ - 6 outs
9 of clubs - 0 outs
2x9 - 11 outs
3x8 - 6 outs

so averaging the outs he has then villian has about 8.23 outs


 
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griffey24
Old 08-18-2008, 03:45 PM #14 (permalink)  
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 15 seconds is making my brain hurt.

Ok I'm trying to learn more PLO lately so I may not be amazing at this.

1: 40%

2: my brain hurts on this one, I can't even tell if we're ahead or not... 45%

3. 28%
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bigspenda73
Old 08-18-2008, 04:01 PM #15 (permalink)  
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 It's crazy how much equity we have in hand 2 if villain has the and not the but it goes to show that not having the nut draw in a lot of spots will significantly reduce your equity. Same goes for hand 3, we'd have 62% instead of 34%

All of these hands btw were hands I played in my last session.

Hands 2 and 3 were me calling 3bets IP and basically hitting what I thought were "gin" flops, only to find out I was up against the NFD in both.

Hand 1 I gladly stacked off also and villain had one of my gutterballs covered plus a set, killing a ton of my equity.
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Old 08-18-2008, 04:26 PM #16 (permalink)  
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nice thread
I forgot about some of the outs in hand 2 like the straight flush out and the ace outs (give full house redraws) and the 8s (derr forgot you can get the low end of a straight as an out)

more hands plx
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Alexos
Old 09-03-2009, 04:35 PM #17 (permalink)  
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 Dunno how I got these numbers but i thought

1.40%
2.25%
3.20%

i have a lot to learn, how the hell can i get so owned on hand 2....
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