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Not Getting Enough? Staying Too Long?

  
 
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arkitekton
Old 09-25-2006, 01:48 AM     Post subject: Not Getting Enough? Staying Too Long? #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: canada
Posts: 269
arkitekton
I had a poorish session recently. Nothing too terrible, but I could use some help with the usual suspects:

Am I staying too long on dubious hands?
Am I not getting the most out of my good hands?

HAND #1:

No reads on this one.

Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A, J.
3 folds, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, 2 folds, MP2 calls.

Flop: (5.50 SB) 2, 5, 9 (2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero bets, MP2 raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) A (2 players)
MP2 checks, Hero bets, MP2 raises, Hero calls.

River: (8.75 BB) 8 (2 players)
MP2 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 10.75 BB


HAND #2

Villain was a weak, intelligent player, if that's not contradictory.

Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K, K.
UTG raises, 1 fold, MP1 calls, 3 folds, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, UTG calls, MP1 caps, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (13.50 SB) 3, T, 2 (3 players)
UTG checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, UTG folds, MP1 calls.

Turn: (8.75 BB) 8 (2 players)
MP1 bets, Hero calls.

River: (10.75 BB) 8 (2 players)
MP1 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 12.75 BB
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Nehmer
Old 09-25-2006, 02:09 AM #2 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Decatur, IL
Posts: 666
Nehmer
Hand 1: Tough spot on the turn with no read. His flop/turn play screams A5 or A9, but it'd be a tough laydown. I call down too with no read.

Hand 2: I raise the turn here. I assume by weak you mean passive which would put his range on probably TT-AA/AK preflop. With no 3-bet on the flop and then a donk on the turn, I think JJ and QQ are the most likely hands for him and if he does have AA(or KK), he's probably not the type to 3-bet back at you, so you aren't risking much on the raise.
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bigspenda73
Old 09-25-2006, 04:12 AM #3 (permalink)  
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Location: Pwnsylvania
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bigspenda73 will become famous soon enoughbigspenda73 will become famous soon enough
 Hand 1: I think I've said it here many times, in Limit the turn or river c/r usually (if not almost always) means a pretty big hand. Unfortunately, the raise prbably does not take you off the hand. At that point the pot has 8.75BBs in it, he is going to put one more BB in on the river that you have to call. Therefore it is like 2:10.75 to calls, or like 5.5:1 about. Trouble is, there is one hand you beat, ATo. I probably lay it down to the turn raise unless villain is a total fish/maniac/donk.

Hand 2: hmm...I put a better player on TT here and a looser one on AT. It's the turn donk that makes you think he has a set, and not AT. As it is, I raise the turn and fold to a 3bet. Thing is, if you just call down, it takes the same amount of bets and you get to go to showdown. So the question is, how many times does he have TT and 3bet you, and how many times does he have AT/QQ/JJ and just call you down. If you think you can win a showdown I call down and don't run the risk of getting 3bet and having to let go of the hand.
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Xanadu
Old 09-25-2006, 03:06 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Location: st. paul, MO
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Xanadu
Any of you notice that MP cold called then capped preflop? That's typically either AA or a gambooler. Key is do you have a read which?
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arkitekton
Old 10-05-2006, 03:24 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Location: canada
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arkitekton
Quote:
Hand 1: Tough spot on the turn with no read. His flop/turn play screams A5 or A9, but it'd be a tough laydown. I call down too with no read.
Good call. He had A9. The more I think about it, the clearer a fold to the turn raise seems. His check raise on the flop cries top pair or second pair, perhaps middle pair with a good kicker (especially an Ace kicker, since that would reverse dominate a lot of hands I could have, and Ace-something is a lot more playable to most people than King-something). The Ace has to look evil to him if he doesn't have two pair or better here, and particularly given that, the pot is awfully small to be worth a 2 big bet bluff over.

Quote:
I probably lay it down to the turn raise unless villain is a total fish/maniac/donk.
Me too--given no reads, I'm kicking myself for this one.

Hand 2:

Quote:
Any of you notice that MP cold called then capped preflop? That's typically either AA or a gambooler. Key is do you have a read which?
Other than "weak, intelligent..." no. Nice observation. She had AA. It was her turn donk that gave me pause. I don't see how I can fold here, but given the flop cap I thought AA was more likely than TT.
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