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pokerlearner
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08-17-2005, 05:27 PM
Post subject: Need some advice and analysis.Please help! Thanks in advance
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: california
Posts: 366
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Hi guys,
Its going to be a long post so please bear with me and thanks for your time and advice. 
I moved up to 3-6 B&M a few days back and after 34 hours of play am absolutely break even. Its been some swing, either I am up 100-150$ 1 day or down 100-150$. Yesterday I was up 130$ in 1 hour and then went all the way to down 135$ in next 4.5 hours. some 260$ swing  . I didnt even play that many hands (however I check called till the river a few times after raised by 2 pair or freak straights on turn  ) or killed at river by straights or flush.
Of course things could be worse and I could be down $200-300 but I feel that my game needs some fixing at this level even though I was doing well and beating 2-4 comfortably and with much less swings.
* I am definitely tighter than the rest of the table but not as tight as I play online at party (0.5-1$ or 1-2 $)
* I always raise or 3 bet preflop with cards that I should. I only cold call with the hands that I can . So I dont feel that I am making mistakes in this area (raising preflop, 3 betting preflop, coldcalling with only premium hands or premium suited hands)
*However, I feel that maybe I am limping in with cards that I should fold . I am regularly limping in with marginal cards Q-10o, K-10o, A-10o, Q-J0 out of position (utg, utg+1, ep) etc. In B&M good hands being so far apart maybe that frustration is getting to me here and since I am folding so much, and see other players win with shit, maybe its a mistake playing like that. What do you think ? a lot of these people even in 3-6 dont raise AA, AK, AQ, KQ so all those hands might have me dominated even when I make my pair. However, maybe just by coincidence or small sample, i havent been dominated by those hands but beaten by their 2 pair or straights, flushes.
* I do count the pot at every street every hand I am in so all decisions I am taking are considering pot odds post flop. But thats why if the flop misses me completely I am folding regularly on the turn as its only overcards and without backdoor draw in big offsuit cards .
* Could it be that my game is just fine barring those limping out of position and its just variance and in time all will be well and good. I do still feel that most of other players are not any better than me and the cards they play I would never play or the way they chase I would never chase (unless the odds are there).
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TylerK
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08-17-2005, 05:35 PM
Post subject: Re: Need some advice and analysis.Please help! Thanks in adv
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#2 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PEANUT BUTTER JELLY TIME
Posts: 1,791
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pokerlearner
*However, I feel that maybe I am limping in with cards that I should fold . I am regularly limping in with marginal cards Q-10o, K-10o, A-10o, Q-J0 out of position (utg, utg+1, ep) etc. In B&M good hands being so far apart maybe that frustration is getting to me here and since I am folding so much, and see other players win with shit, maybe its a mistake playing like that. What do you think ?
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I think this is a bigger leak than you realize.
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TylerK: its just gambling if i want to worry about money i'll go to work lol
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Nehmer
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Decatur, IL
Posts: 666
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It sounds to me like you know exactly what is going on. Yes, limping with some of those hands like QTo is usually a bad idea. Yes, variance is playing a huge part in your results so far, you have to play a ton before variance isn't the main part. Just keep playing, at a B&M table you are seeing so few hands that it will take a long time before you know how you are really doing at 3/6.
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Cold calling is permittable only with some pocket pairs with lots of other callers, weaker suited aces or stronger suited kings
You should cold call maybe once every three hours on average
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pokerlearner
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Flush
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: california
Posts: 366
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Coldcalling is not a problem in my game (in my opinion, but i could be wrong) . Only hands I play when there is a raise in front of me are these
* reraise with AA-10-10, AK 0-s, AQ o-s.
* call with KQs,KJs, AJs, JQs
is there any hand here that i cant cold call with ??
everything else is a fold. so coldcalling should not be a leak here.
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I also raise preflop with AA-10-10, AKo-s- AQo-s any position, 99-88 MP1 onwards, AJo-s CO or button.
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Reraise with KQs and AJs if the table's loose (otherwise fold). Fold QJs.
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A'aag
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Straight
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Loyal son of Rochester
Posts: 172
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by pokerlearner
* call with KQs,KJs, AJs, JQs
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Depends on the table and the raiser, but I'd say this is a problem, especially if you're the first cold caller. I'd much rather 3-bet with AJs and KQs, but I'm still tossing them against most opponents. In these situations I'd much rather have something like 98s because most flops I like won't put me in a position of being dominated by the PF raiser. I'm not saying you should cold call with 98, but I'm trying to explain why I really don't like any of these hands facing a raise without a multiway pot going. Playing live can be really boring when you're used to quad tabling or whatever, and I definitely know the feeling of just wanting to play a hand already, but if it's costing you money, is it worth it? If you're playing these hands after a raise and a few calls you're probably fine, but you already said you're limping UTG with things like QT0 when you get bored, so I suspect you're also making some bad cold calls.
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RiverMonkey
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08-17-2005, 09:23 PM
Post subject: Re: Need some advice and analysis.Please help! Thanks in adv
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#8 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 446
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by TylerK
Quote:
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Originally Posted by pokerlearner
*However, I feel that maybe I am limping in with cards that I should fold . I am regularly limping in with marginal cards Q-10o, K-10o, A-10o, Q-J0 out of position (utg, utg+1, ep) etc. In B&M good hands being so far apart maybe that frustration is getting to me here and since I am folding so much, and see other players win with shit, maybe its a mistake playing like that. What do you think ?
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I think this is a bigger leak than you realize. |
Tyler speaks the truth!
Don't let the "other players are winning lots of pots with crap" factor sway you towards making horrible pre-flop calls. QTo, KTo, small pocket pairs and suited connectors are all dangerous hands to play from EP. This leak is especially bad in tight/aggressive games. You're LP opponents are already at a distinct advantage positionally, don't give them another leg up by playing cards that are easily dominated, and/or are only EV+'ve with lots of callers.
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offsuit hands like QT and JT should be thrown away in a full game
they just don't win pots enough to even justify the initial call
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by iopq
offsuit hands like QT and JT should be thrown away in a full game
they just don't win pots enough to even justify the initial call
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You so silly. I'll raise up monsters like K9o and J9s in some spots. Domination only means you have bigger cards and when the guy with a 70/20 split limps it's a non-issue.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
Quote:
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Originally Posted by iopq
offsuit hands like QT and JT should be thrown away in a full game
they just don't win pots enough to even justify the initial call
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You so silly. I'll raise up monsters like K9o and J9s in some spots. Domination only means you have bigger cards and when the guy with a 70/20 split limps it's a non-issue. |
I probably should have said *UTG*
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pokerlearner
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Flush
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: california
Posts: 366
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what is 70/20 ?
" Domination only means you have bigger cards and when the guy with a 70/20 split limps it's a non-issue."
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gutshot
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: lemonade was a popular drink and it still is
Posts: 608
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70% vp$ip/20% preflop raise.
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-jay
"i think the biggest leak in my game is using 2nd level thinking against players who can't think on the first level." -Renton
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gutshot
70% vp$ip/20% preflop raise.
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The GREAT thing about those guys is that when they limp you KNOW they have crap or just maybe AA/KK/AK and nothing in between.
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