www.flopturnriver.com

Poker Forum

Over 1,246,000 Posts!

Already Registered? Username: Password: Remember Forgot Password
Tweet

My first 1,000 hands at Party

LinkBack

Thread Tools

Display Modes

lonnie

10-08-2004, 09:28 PM Post subject: My first 1,000 hands at Party

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

I finally tried Party, to get the bonus and because I've heard here how loose the play was. Overall, I like Party, I 've been fairly successful there. Been playing two .50/1.00 tables at a time and logging the results in Poker Tracker.

Here's the stats:

Hands: 1000
VP$IP: 23.90
W$WSF: 27.36
WTSD: 30.50
W$SD: 50.52
PFR: 3.42
BB/100: +5.83

Aggression factor: .58

I know this is very passive play by most of your standards (especially Fnord), and I am prepared to be called a sissy. I would like to know what some of the other win rates .50/1.00 are maintaining. At 800 hands, I was around 8.5, but I've leveled off some since.

I started the account up with 50.00, got the 25.00 bonus, and now have 150.64 in the account. This is including 23.00 that I have won playing SNG's.

I have won 58.00 playing limit ring games at Party Poker, but have paid 30.00 in rake. The fact that Party rakes .50 from a 5.00 pot really cuts into the win rate. Poker Stars only rakes .25 from a 5.00 pot. I know Party lowers the rake as the pot increases, but you get a LOT of pots in the 5-10 range on .50/1.00 limit games.

As a comparison, I have played 707 .50/1.00 limit ring games at Stars and have a 6.65 BB/hand win rate so far. I have won 47.00, and only paid 12.75 in rake.

I'll grind out 300 more hands at Stars and get a better comparison later. I know 10K is the amount of hands where you really start to get accurate numbers, but I have to start somewhere. And 10K hands takes quite a while, even playing 2 tables at a time.

On a side note: does anyone know how I can copy/paste the stats from Poker Tracker? I can't highlight the text or use CNTRL-C or any of the usual methods.

Play for FREE and practice your game at...

Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!

Fnord

10-08-2004, 10:07 PM Post subject: Re: My first 1,000 hands at Party

#2 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

VP$IP: 23.90

A bit high, although .5/1 players suck enough that you can get away playing a few extra hands. Try tightening up, then put back in some more hands.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

W$WSF: 27.36
WTSD: 30.50
W$SD: 50.52

Lots of multi-pots? Not taking down many pots with aggression?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

PFR: 3.42

Even by weak standards you should be able to get this up to 5%. Are you limping AKo? Cold calling when you should 3-bet or fold?

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

BB/100: +5.83

Nice run of cards. Hard to nail down a win rate until you get a run of "#$*^ fish chase with anything and hit."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

lonnie

10-09-2004, 08:30 AM

#3 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

Thanks for the analysis Fnord. I agree with every point.

Quote:

A bit high, although .5/1 players suck enough that you can get away playing a few extra hands. Try tightening up, then put back in some more hands.

Agreed. I am still a sucker for Ax suited, and I need to get away from it. The trap is that every now and then you can pull in a BIG pot. Usually you end up either throwing your hand away post flop or losing money with a crappy kicker when an A flops. Need to go through Poker Tracker and determine what I am overplaying. I also play suited connectors into raised pots often, trying to take advantage of over agressive PF raisers if the flop hits me.

Quote:

Lots of multi-pots? Not taking down many pots with aggression?

Lots of multi-pots is correct. I seem to play suited connectors and other drawing hands much better than I do TPTK. I am weak when it comes to playing overcards, second pairs, and knowing when to lay down my TPTK. I think the overcard weakness is only a marginal effect to the win rate, but my uncertainty with second pair is frustrating. So many people wait until the turn to bet their TPTK, trips etc.

Quote:

Even by weak standards you should be able to get this up to 5%. Are you limping AKo? Cold calling when you should 3-bet or fold?

I am limping AKo half of the time. I raise with it in early position - to get weak hands out, and limp in late position, because I have noticed that most people don't fold to a PFR once they have money in the pot.

I am starting to rethink this, though, because of how many times I have seen everyone check to the PFR'r. Might be possible to get a free card by raising preflop. I also limp with QQ almost everytime. My pre-flop game definitely needs work.

Quote:

Nice run of cards. Hard to nail down a win rate until you get a run of "#$*^ fish chase with anything and hit."

I did have a nice run. At 800 hands my win rate was around 8.5 BB/100, then I hit a small slide, but recovered. My bankroll is back to what it was, but my win rate is obviously down with the added hands.

mike4066

10-09-2004, 01:07 PM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Dec 2003

Posts: 1,943

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

Agreed. I am still a sucker for Ax suited, and I need to get away from it.

I still enjoy these hands too. But I only play the in the last 2 positions, with 2+ people in an unraised pot.
I'll complete my small blinds with Axs and also call a raise in the BB with it if 2 people have already called the raise before me.

I could go on for hours about the reasons not to limp AK and certainly QQ. Instead I'm going to make a different suggestion.

Take $25 of your poker winnings and buy SMALL STAKES HOLDEM.

If you want i'll send you the PDF Versions of the starting hands they have so you can see some of the preflop plays they make.

Fnord

10-09-2004, 08:05 PM

#5 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

Ax suited on a limp good (I've made a lot of money here at 2/4.) Suited connector on a raise bad (unless it's 4+ way.) Still you want to get in cheap with these hands.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

Always raise it for value! You dominate non-wired Ax and Kx's and win more than your fair share (although it's hard to belive when some idiot scoops the pot.) Maybe fold AKo to a raise + 3-bet. Probalby fold to a raise + 3-bet + cap. Just because you raise pre-flop it doesn't mean you can't fold to a horrible flop or missed turn.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

I also limp with QQ almost everytime.

I'll pretend you didn't say that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Fnord

10-09-2004, 08:10 PM

#6 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike4066

I still enjoy these hands too. But I only play the in the last 2 positions, with 2+ people in an unraised pot.

At the right table I'll open-limp it from EP. CO & Button it's usually an easy steal. It depends on how big my X is. Certainly A9s is worth a limp at most tables.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Fnord

10-09-2004, 08:22 PM

#7 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

My 2/4 stats so far for this month...

2,498 hands
17.25 VP$IP
10.53% PFR
net +625.25
6.26BB/100
32% W$WSF
58.33% W$@SD
AF 3.17 (excluding pre-flop)

Although there is a little somewhat short-handed play in there...

A9s - A2s
Net +$236

22 - 99
Net -$49.75 (bad run, mostly)

AKo -$102 (really bad run)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

lonnie

10-09-2004, 09:32 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

Suited connectors - I was talking about multi-way pots. I don't try and play them head-up, and usually abandon them in the latter stages of a tournament also.

The AK limp is bad, I agree. Raising for value from any position makes sense. I am winning with AKo and AKs more than half of the time I hold it.

The QQ limp is debatable. Checking PokerTracker, I've raised with it 3 out of 4 times at Stars and am down 4.25 on the hand. At Party I've raised with it 1 out of 4 times and I'm up 4.25. How powerful is QQ against the .50/1.00 crowd anyway where you routinely get 4-5 way action? I play the hand much stronger in a NL game where I can isolate an opponent. This is definitely one of the hands I keep an eye on, because I know how easy it is for player to get "married" to this pocket pair. I'm sure plenty of people are lifetime losers with QQ.

I will eventually take your advice on these hands I'm sure, probably slowly working it into the mix. I've only been playing poker since July so I'm in the early stages of my development. When I first started I was seeing 50%+ of the flops, playing incorrectly into 3 suited or paired boards, etc.

Thanks again for the analysis.

Fnord

10-09-2004, 10:20 PM

#9 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

Suited connectors - I was talking about multi-way pots. I don't try and play them head-up, and usually abandon them in the latter stages of a tournament also.

They're over-rated. This comes from people with thousands of hands in PT. Yes, we're talking multi-pot here (4+ way.) Big cards win pots.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

The AK limp is bad, I agree. Raising for value from any position makes sense. I am winning with AKo and AKs more than half of the time I hold it.

I'm at around a 48% win rate with it. Although I would expect more multi-pots at .5/1. Hence, fewer bigger wins.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

The QQ limp is debatable. Checking PokerTracker, I've raised with it 3 out of 4 times at Stars and am down 4.25 on the hand. At Party I've raised with it 1 out of 4 times and I'm up 4.25. How powerful is QQ against the .50/1.00 crowd anyway where you routinely get 4-5 way action? I play the hand much stronger in a NL game where I can isolate an opponent. This is definitely one of the hands I keep an eye on, because I know how easy it is for player to get "married" to this pocket pair. I'm sure plenty of people are lifetime losers with QQ.

That is so wrong! I'll take QQ over AKo any day, even in limit. Although, I have about the same win rate of BB/hand right now (over 22.7k hands of 2/4 and 3/6 limit). No way anyone with a clue is a lifetime loser with QQ. AA-JJ and probaby TT should all be auto-raises in any unraised pot. AA-QQ are auto-3-bets. A sample size of 8 in a high variance game is nothing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

stevedonel

10-11-2004, 05:32 PM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: Vegas

Posts: 617

I played against lhoney2 for a while last night. Seemed fairly tight from what I saw, not to many hands though. I did see you drag a couple nice pots.

Fnord, what are raising with to get your PFR up so high? I seem to play best with my VP$IP around 18-20 and PFR 4-6. I'd have to go home to look up my exact stats.

I raise with:
AA-99, AK from any position
AA-55, AK-AJ, KQ from the last positions

Reraise with
AA-JJ always
AA-99, AK-AJ depending on the player and position

I've know for quite some time that this is playing to tight, but find that I get myself in to many bad situations when loosening up. I know that I need to work on my post-flop play to improve this.

I tried to play following the suggestions from the SSH "tight game" list yesterday, and got into alot of the questionable situations that typically lose me money. I'd hate to think what would happen if I played the "loose game" list. Are you playing something similar to one of their lists?

While I have been profitable, I think I'm stuck at the 50¢/$1 game until I can get this fixed.

Is that guy still part of the forum??

Fnord

10-11-2004, 05:47 PM

#11 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

I'm not too scientific about pre-flop. I'm at the point now where reads and table texture feed into it.

Here is my approximate raise list:

UTG (first 2 positions at a 10 player table):
AK/AQ
AJs/ATs/KQs
AA-TT
sometimes 99-88 (tight table only)
sometimes AJ/KQ (loose table only)
consider limping AQo, AA and KK at a tight table.

EP Add:
99/88
AJ/KQ
KJs/QJs

MP Add:
77?
AT
A9s/A8s
KJ/QJ
KTs/QTs/JTs

Button/CO:
KT/QT
Lots of other stuff on a steal

I never raise pocket pairs below 88/77 or so unless I'm on a steal or defending against a loose steal.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

lonnie

10-11-2004, 08:59 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

Fnord - do you think a lot of the plays you are talking about may be a bit advanced for the lower limit games? I've read a little bit of Sklansky, and your play sounds a lot like the plays in his advanced book. It also sounds a lot like the play I have seen when railbirding the 100/200 LHE game at Stars. 3 betting and capping with cards I wouldn't dream of even raising.

I got a chance to read Winning Low Limit Holdem today, which I have seen raved about here. I did pick up quite a bit. I read the whole thing in a little less than 2 hours and put it neatly back on the shelf at Barnes and Noble - yes I am that cheap.

Check raising the flop when I hit top pair/nice kicker is a play I will definitely add. I have almost not been check raising at all and have been missing quite a few bets because of it. Reading the book, I discovered that I have been folding hands post flop and on the turn in a manner exactly compliant with the book. I'll attribute my success so far to proper folding and definitely not to proper raising.

I am also playing too many hands in early position - little pairs, connectors, etc. I need to tighten up in early position, and actually loosen up more in late position. WLLH advises to play stuff like Kxs on the button - not sure about that play...

Fnord - what is a reasonable BB/100 to expect from .50/1.00? At 1300 hands it has actually increased to 7.26 BB/100 hands. I guess a lucky run of cards got luckier?

I would like to get together with limit players from FTR sometime to put some of our ideas into practice. It would have to be at a .25/50 or .50/1.00 game for me though. Bankroll is not quite ready for the move to 1.00/2.00. Would anyone else be interested in getting together for a limit ring sometime? Think that would be fun.

Fnord

10-11-2004, 09:06 PM

#13 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

You're better off learning how to play marginal positions when it's cheap.

Also, this is my raise list. I haven't even discussed 3-betting. When facing a raise against a typical player I'm wicked tight.

We're not even talking about weird plays like raising 87s UTG at a tight table...

When players are calling 2 cold with monsters like K8s, not raising KQo is letting them off too easy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

I am also playing too many hands in early position - little pairs, connectors, etc. I need to tighten up in early position, and actually loosen up more in late position. WLLH advises to play stuff like Kxs on the button - not sure about that play...

Connectors lose value out of position, but small pairs are less affected. In a loose game you should be trying to see a flop with any pair. It's the perfect hand to wield against the onslaught of loose calls.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Fnord

10-11-2004, 11:54 PM

#14 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveDonel

Reraise with
AA-JJ always
AA-99, AK-AJ depending on the player and position

Against a raise with no cold calls

vs Rock
3-bet: AA/KK/QQ
cc: AKs
fold: AK

vs Tightie
3-bet: AK/AA/KK/QQ

vs Typical:
3-bet: AK/AA/KK/QQ/JJ maybe TT
cc: AQs

vs a Loose raiser:
3-bet: AK/AA/KK/QQ/JJ/TT/AQ
cc: AJs

vs a Maniac:
Anything I would raise, pretty much. Bias towards hands with high heads-up value.

note: AJo/ATo/KQo are pretty much always mucked to any raise!

After one or two cold-callers you can start bringing in strong multi-pot hands. Suited big stuff, med pocket pairs, etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Fnord

10-15-2004, 11:13 PM

#15 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

I'm in a moderating mood. Made sticky, some great pre-flop discussion and common questions answered...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

zenbitz

10-30-2004, 03:40 AM Post subject: *MY* first 1000 hands at Party

#16 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 2,911

With my home-brew poker tracker, so hey, maybe buggy.

V$IP: 38.29%
Saw 25.54% of flops (including blinds)
Aggression: 1.675

Classified myself as "Loose/Aggressive" <frown>

I am definitely winning... my first 400-odd hands I was up 8BB/100. Have to recalculate now.

I am using the following PRE-FLOP matrix:
http://www.posev.com/poker/holdem/st...lop-abdul.html

But I think I am superloose in the SB, probably more like 80% than the recommend 50. I should cut that out.

I don't think 26% is very high for # of flops - so my guess is that my V$IP is high because I bet too much Post flop.... have to dig deeper there.

lonnie

10-30-2004, 09:20 AM

#17 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

Quote:

V$IP: 38.29%
Saw 25.54% of flops (including blinds)

The VP$IP number should be lower than total flops number.

zenbitz

10-30-2004, 03:09 PM

#18 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 2,911

Maybe I am calculating it wrong?

V$IP = bets+calls+raises / actions (including checks/folds)
Or is it PER HAND???

%flops seen includes blinds

stuck

10-30-2004, 03:41 PM

#19 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenbitz

Maybe I am calculating it wrong?

V$IP = bets+calls+raises / actions (including checks/folds)
Or is it PER HAND???

%flops seen includes blinds

V$IP is per hand, did you put money into the pot?

For example, you have #hands, #V$IP. The percentage is #V$IP/#hands.

if you limp, fold on the flop, #V$IP increases by one. if you're in on the hand and every street is capped, #V$IP still only increases by one. if you're on the BB and check to see the flop, fold. #V$IP does not increase.

%flops seen, you're right, does increase in a check/fold from the blinds

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

stuck

10-30-2004, 03:43 PM

#20 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

I think I remember you saying somewhere before that you usually muck 22-55 in early or middle (often late) position. Does that only apply for a tight game?

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

Toasty

10-30-2004, 05:56 PM

#21 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2004

Location: England UK

Posts: 1,522

WOW FNORD YOU ARE ON FIRE!!!!!!!!

Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .

zenbitz

10-30-2004, 11:09 PM Post subject: Actual Stats for 1000 hands at party

#22 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 2,911

OK, not that I have been reeducated, fixed some logic and syntax errors in my personal poker tracker program....

(all .50/1.0 Party)

Agression 1.601
V$IP: 26%
"Action Rating" - 37%
(this is what I thought was V$IP before, bets+calls+raises/possible actions)
Saw 28.48% of flops (including blinds)

Won 11.75 BB/100 Hands in 1099 hands.

Rated: "Aggressive".
I think I can cut down my V$IP by completing way fewer SB. Have to work on that agression... probably too many cold calls, right Fnord.

My NL tourney stats are kinda grim -$50 overall. I did win a $10/1 SNG ($50) and 2nd in a 3-table $5/1 ($37.50)....

stuck

10-30-2004, 11:21 PM Post subject: Re: Actual Stats for 1000 hands at party

#23 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenbitz

V$IP: 26%

that's a bit high (it should be more around 20%)

what's the percentage for the small blind (should be ~30%)? You might be completing too much, and that could bring it down.

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

zenbitz

10-31-2004, 01:56 AM

#24 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 2,911

For my first 450 hands, I was completing the small blind >80% of the time! I have since tightened up a little, but I probably play 1/2 of them. Haven't checked on the last 600, since my program doesn't track that, and my demo PT database is full (stupidly imported a bunch of tournaments). I was down about $5.00 (5BB), but that's probably just luck.

My "guide" (abdul's) sez XX suited, Jx, and 63os or better 2 gappers from the SB - about 52% of all hands.

Since the .5/1 Party is so loose, I guess I will keep most of the suited hands, but drop the total dreck (gappers off-suit, maybe keep J7 if there are several limpers)

Fnord

10-31-2004, 02:04 AM

#25 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

My rough SB list for completing in a ~1/2 format:
Any pocket pair
Suited connectors
Suited 1 gappers
Suited 2 gappers
A9 or better
Any suited Ace
K8s or better
Nines or better suited
Jacks or better offsuit.

Stay away from the offsuit junk and single big offsuit cards with a weak kicker.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

lonnie

11-01-2004, 10:39 AM

#26 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

My October stats from PT:

1/2 - 850 hands, 19.76% VP$IP, 4.94% PFR, + 81.62 (4.8 BB/100)

.50/1.00 - 3,786 hands, 22.42 VP$IP, 5.31% PFR, +197.49 (5.22 BB/100)

.25/.50 - 2,109 hands, 23.38 VP$IP, 6.31% PFR, +100.83 (9.56 BB/100)

.05/.10 - 2,725 hands, 23.74 VP$IP, 7.63% PFR, + 25.50 (9.36 BB/100)

and for fun:

NL (.02) - 1,032 hands, 23.45 VP$IP, 5.33% PFR, + 15.06 (36.48 BB/100)

It was ridiculous playing all of those hands of .05/.10 limit, but I did it because I wanted to have more discipline. I figured if I could tighten up my starting hand requirements on a nickel game, I could really tighten up on the higher limits. The low limit also allowed me the latitude to try new plays out risk free to my bankroll, and get more used to hitting the raise button in marginal spots.

I did notice one interesting trend. I was an overall winner on every day of the week except for Tuesday. Anyone else have trouble winning on Tuesday? I'm thinking there must be fewer fish out on those days or something.

Probably will be playing more 1/2 on Party in the next month and limit my .50/1.00 to PokerStars. The .50/1.00 limit game at Party IS easy to beat, but the aggressive plays I am wanting to incorporate into my game won't work at Party .50/1.00.

Including play at Pacific and Prima and a few bonuses, I am up ~800 for the month. Not bad for a hobby. I used to waste just as much time playing chess but I don't remember ever earning a penny for my time.

I find it hard to believe I will ever have a month where I learned as much about limit holdem as I did this month.

A few specific goals for November:

Learn how to play Axs effectively. I am losing way too much money on these, especially when an A hits the flop. Thinking about removing ATs-A2s from my starting hands altogether until I study these hands more.

Figure out just what the hell to do with QJo. I am playing it way too much and seem to get outkicked an inordinate amount of times on my pairs. Definitely a leak here also.

Thanks to Fnord, Mike and a few others for the wisdom.

Fnord

11-01-2004, 02:57 PM

#27 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

Learn how to play Axs effectively. I am losing way too much money on these, especially when an A hits the flop. Thinking about removing ATs-A2s from my starting hands altogether until I study these hands more.

Odd, most of these hands are profitable for me. A9s-A2s make me more money than 66-22.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lhoney2

Figure out just what the hell to do with QJo. I am playing it way too much and seem to get outkicked an inordinate amount of times on my pairs. Definitely a leak here also.

Last 4 positions before the blinds. Also, be careful picking your spots to raise it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

zenbitz

11-01-2004, 03:24 PM

#28 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 2,911

Fnord -

Why K8 on your list? Not K7? K9 seems at least passibly better with the 3 triple gut shot (shotgun gutshot?)

mike4066

11-01-2004, 03:24 PM

#29 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Dec 2003

Posts: 1,943

I just looked at my stats

I'm playing Ax and small pairs horribly..

Fnord

11-01-2004, 05:04 PM

#30 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenbitz

Fnord -

Why K8 on your list? Not K7? K9 seems at least passibly better with the 3 triple gut shot (shotgun gutshot?)

At some point we're talking thin +EV, neutral EV or thin -EV. It doesn't matter much exectly where you draw the line. The bigger your kicker, the higher chance of 2 pair or trip kings holding up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

lonnie

11-10-2004, 09:55 PM

#31 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

Here's a neato Axs hand I just had. Am I overplaying this hand? I am trying to curb my aggression on the flop, as it has become a leak as of late. I couldn't resist this one though, especially with so many callers.

I think I had to call the river, even though I missed. How often do you think I am good here?

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A

, 2

.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button folds, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 8

, 4

, 3

(6 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG raises, UTG+1 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, SB folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG calls, MP3 calls, CO calls.

Turn: (9 BB) A

(4 players)
Hero bets, UTG calls, MP3 calls, CO raises, Hero calls, UTG calls, MP3 calls.

River: (17 BB) 6

(4 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP3 checks, CO bets, Hero calls, UTG calls, MP3 folds.

Final Pot: 20 BB
Main Pot: 20 BB, between Hero, UTG and CO.

|~|ypermegachi

11-10-2004, 10:01 PM

#32 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: emo-kid

Posts: 3,580

i think i would cap the turn on that hand. and if i miss, check/call.

zenbitz

11-10-2004, 10:28 PM

#33 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2004

Posts: 2,911

I think it's read dependent. If UTG is a calling station, he probably has like 8X or non-nut flush draw and is in 3rd place at best. CO clearly has you out kicked.

IF UTG is a known bad player, I think the 3-bet on the flop is the correct move, otherwise, I think it's dicey. Turn seems good. I guess the river call is worth it for the info and the chance of a split...

Latest Poker News
KoRnholio	05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
According to an email sent out by Mark Bryan, a gaming analyst at Merrill Lynch, the Australian government plans to legalize online poker sometime in the next six to 12 months. This move will coincide ... more at Poker Blogs »

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts BB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is Off Trackbacks are On Pingbacks are On Refbacks are On Forum Rules

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:07 PM.

Play Texas Holdem Online, Online Texas Holdem Strategy, & Poker Forum

This is not a gambling website.

Poker Forum

Over 1,246,000 Posts!

Poker Forum

All Other (Limit) Poker

My first 1,000 hands at Party

Play for FREE and practice your game at...