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Chopper

12-17-2008, 08:38 PM Post subject: more "moves..."

#1 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

here come a couple i liked and use a lot down here...

favorite spot to bluff a limit player. villain was 44/2/.6 and still bluffable. i love paired turns in orphan pots.

0.5/1 Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($39.25)
UTG+1 ($36.20)
CO ($20.85)
BTN ($28.25)
SB ($6.10)
Hero (BB) ($47.45)

Pre-flop: (1.5 SB, 6 players) Hero is BB

4 folds, SB calls, Hero checks

Flop:

(2.0 SB, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn:

(1.0 BB, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, SB folds

Final Pot: 1.0 BB

Hero wins 1.9 BB ( won +0.4 BB )
SB lost 0.5 BB

villain is 40/30/1.6 and in his own head about the game being rigged. (he mentioned it twice already) i LOVE these types of moves from the blinds, and dont need that "read" to try it. i didnt think he would fold, but thought there was a chance. i was more trying to see if he called or raised to see if i could take it from him later. plan was to float since he has already scared himself..

0.5/1 Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($32.00)
UTG+1 ($31.80)
CO ($27.00)
BTN ($28.20)
SB ($9.45)
Hero (BB) ($48.05)

Pre-flop: (1.5 SB, 6 players) Hero is BB

3 folds, BTN raises, 1 fold, Hero calls

Flop:

(4.5 SB, 2 players)
Hero bets, BTN folds

Final Pot: 2.2 BB

Hero wins 2.6 BB ( won +1.1 BB )
BTN lost 1.0 BB

variation of hand one...villains are 77% and 80% vpip players. even they know how to fold a scary board that looks like it "whiffed its c/r."

0.5/1 Limit Holdem
5 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($35.65)
CO ($16.65)
BTN ($82.30)
SB ($9.15)
Hero (BB) ($35.75)

Pre-flop: (1.5 SB, 5 players) Hero is BB

1 fold, CO calls, 1 fold, SB calls, Hero checks

Flop:

(3.0 SB, 3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, CO checks

Turn:

(1.5 BB, 3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, CO folds, SB folds

Final Pot: 1.5 BB

Hero wins 2.5 BB ( won +1.0 BB )
CO lost 0.5 BB
SB lost 0.5 BB

thoughts?

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

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DrivingDog

12-17-2008, 08:52 PM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2007

Location: UK

Posts: 923

1) I probably just bet the flop. Once you're checked to twice, I'm betting atc here.

2) A bit questionable, since that board hits his range fairly hard. If he checks behind the flop i probably take a stab on the turn.

3) You probably have the best hand and would have won more if you'd raised preflop. Vs. limpy and SB caller AT is huge.

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on." (George Bush).

Chopper

12-17-2008, 08:57 PM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

2) i figure he fires atc if i check to him. i felt i needed to bet at him if i had any chance to win...now OR later. and, i had not been caught bluffing yet, and had shown some pretty big hands....against him...lol.\

3) duely noted.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Lance

12-17-2008, 11:15 PM

#4 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Nov 2007

Posts: 210

1.) Heads up, if he checked to me on the flop i should bet whatever i have in position. You risk 0,5BB for 1BB..you need min 33% fold equity. If villian is calling station i would never bet here, against solid player i would bet 100%.
2.) c/f for me. 2 overcards here and OOP, even with gutshot
3.) raise preflop for sure,
+ you have strong hand with showdown value
- almost no money in the pot
- 1 player acts after you
in unraised pot its not easy decision, i am often called by 45o, so i would check on the turn. I admit it can be my another leak....

Chopper

12-18-2008, 12:52 AM

#5 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

1) which is why i waited. i dont fire oop for a sb into stations. however, when that 5 paired, i figured first one in grabs the pot most times.
2)even with a maniacal 40/30 player? i will spew 1/2 bets into him to put him in his place and garner respect. i will also get into crazy bvb wars with them. i rarely fold ANYTHING in a HU pot with them, too. they just drop money with the craziest shit.
3)i dont like dominated hands oop. i should have seen that AT does well against these two, but i figured theres also a good chance they call down light and catch some gay pair, too. so, i felt it better to use a SSHE approach and take a flop first before investing too much with what i figured, at the time, to be a marginal hand oop.

anyway, live and learn.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Chopper

12-18-2008, 12:53 AM

#6 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

just ran it through pokerstove...i gaffed this one, even oop. wont happen again. i'll just drop my raising range oop another notch or two after this (against players this loose).

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 27.918% 27.58% 00.34% 1964154862 24252285.17 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 92s+, 82s+, 73s+, 62s+, 52s+, 43s, A2o+, K2o+, Q2o+, J3o+, T5o+, 95o+, 85o+, 75o+, 65o, 54o }
Hand 1: 30.489% 29.38% 01.11% 2092619035 78974353.67 { 22+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 93s+, 84s+, 74s+, 63s+, 53s+, 43s, A2o+, K2o+, Q3o+, J5o+, T6o+, 96o+, 86o+, 76o }
Hand 2: 41.593% 40.69% 00.91% 2897967715 64469533.17 { ATo }

i am trusting you on this a bit, dog. but, isnt 41% shitty against TWO stations like this?? can you shed some light on why AT is as strong as you say? i see this as my 40% against a combined 60%....and i dont like them odds.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Lance

12-18-2008, 09:12 AM

#7 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Nov 2007

Posts: 210

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chopper

If you win triple money on 41% its profitable for you.
I think if you have hand equity higher than 33% in case of 2 limpers, the hand should be raised preflop.
On the other hand i read in ALHS if you have QQ or JJ in the BB you shouldnt raise against more than 2 opponents. And the reason for that is that possibility of coming overcards is one third of time at QQ and over half time for JJ.
This issue is not clear for me as well. I somewhere read that the boardline hand is A9o. Everything higher should be raised preflop from blinds with limpers. But what about QJs or KQo.
Is it correct to raise with KQo with 3 or 4 limpers ? really i am not sure (i am still talking from position of blinds).

Chopper

12-18-2008, 01:23 PM

#8 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

personally, in a game where players tend to cold call and play lots of hands, i see the quandary. on the one hand, you know you have an equity advantage pf. on the other hand, you are playing some easily dominated hands pretty fast, oop, and into multiple players.

i suppose this is where postflop skill needs to really take over, and i dont have it just yet. i am better than i was 6 months ago for sure, but there are still some areas i am not to confident in....this being one.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

DrivingDog

12-18-2008, 03:59 PM

#9 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2007

Location: UK

Posts: 923

If they're bad enough to limp in on AJ-AK, they're bad enough to limp in on A2-A9 or anything sooooted. So you're more likely the dominator than the dominatee. Take their money.

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on." (George Bush).

Chopper

12-18-2008, 04:41 PM

#10 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrivingDog

If they're bad enough to limp in on AJ-AK, they're bad enough to limp in on A2-A9 or anything sooooted. So you're more likely the dominator than the dominatee. Take their money.

so, we have KJ instead of AT. are you still raising this one against these morons? QTs, how low do you go? 55?

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

DrivingDog

12-18-2008, 08:49 PM

#11 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2007

Location: UK

Posts: 923

Meh I go on feel. If they're really cripplers (limpers) and play fit-or fold on the flop I can raise just about anything. But if they tend to call the flop regardless that makes it tougher.

I don't know I've just played so much LHE now that I'm often going on instinct, which makes it hard to elucidate my rationale sometimes.

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on." (George Bush).

Chopper

12-18-2008, 09:29 PM

#12 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

i feel the same way about "playing so much i can go on instinct and rationale looks non-standard as hell."

but, i am way ahead of myself most times. i am not that good....yet...lol.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

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