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G_host
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11-12-2005, 07:43 PM
Post subject: Loose table , KQo with a lot of limpers
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 227
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The table is realy loose, 6-7 that see an unraised flop has been usal the last orbits. SB is a bluffer that often CR the turn with nothing,low pair or draw and sees 60% flops.
All other involved sees to many flops and are passive post flop.
And lastly should I woory enough for the flush not to bet the river?
Not folding on the flop so is the raise right or just gambool? Should I raise the turn?
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx
Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K , Q . CO posts a blind of $2.
UTG calls, 1 fold, UTG+2 calls, 1 fold, Hero calls, 1 fold, CO (poster) checks, Button calls, SB raises, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero calls, CO calls, Button calls.
Flop: (14 SB) 8, J, 6 (7 players)
SB bets, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero raises, CO calls, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+2 calls.
Turn: (13 BB) T (6 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, UTG+2 folds, Hero calls, CO raises, SB calls, BB folds, UTG calls, Hero calls.
River: (21 BB) 9 (4 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets, CO calls, SB folds, UTG calls.
Final Pot: 24 BB
Edited out a bit,missed that I got the open endend on the Turn not just Gutshot.
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Nehmer
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Decatur, IL
Posts: 666
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I see no reason to raise this flop. You have almost zero fold equity after so many people have called one bet and you have a very crappy draw. I'm just calling one on a flop like this and folding the turn unimproved.
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G_host
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 227
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Nehmer
I see no reason to raise this flop. You have almost zero fold equity after so many people have called one bet and you have a very crappy draw. I'm just calling one on a flop like this and folding the turn unimproved.
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Made a stab at getting the button and maybe a free river since one was a poster and button was LPP. But wouldn't have asked if I did't feel a bit like you.
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nemofromuscl
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Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 46
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Isn't there no reason to even call the flop? 7 BB and what cards can you get that you are happy with? A queen could make someones straight, a king could lose to 2 pair. It seems with so many people in the pot all you can be happy with is a straight with no flush. These odds are 1/20, no? Then if the flush comes you can't really be happy right?
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pokerfanatic
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: 6max limit tables
Posts: 1,968
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Nehmer
I see no reason to raise this flop. You have almost zero fold equity after so many people have called one bet and you have a very crappy draw. I'm just calling one on a flop like this and folding the turn unimproved.
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no one folds here i don't see the point either...
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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I dont like the furn raise either, if it were HU then I would do it, but since you have 3 people in between it will unlikely buy you a free card. However, folding this flop would be rather detrimental. You have 2 back door draws and 2 overcards; and you're getting 19-1 to call!! I call this flop with 22 as this pot is out of control and even if you have a slight chance of winning you need to stay in.
The river I think your play was fine, the flush may have hit but you give up too much value in not betting with 3 opponents that could call with anything. Missing 3 bets on the river is much worse than saving yourself 1.
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G_host
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 227
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by elipsesjeff
I dont like the furn raise either, if it were HU then I would do it, but since you have 3 people in between it will unlikely buy you a free card. However, folding this flop would be rather detrimental. You have 2 back door draws and 2 overcards; and you're getting 19-1 to call!! I call this flop with 22 as this pot is out of control and even if you have a slight chance of winning you need to stay in.
The river I think your play was fine, the flush may have hit but you give up too much value in not betting with 3 opponents that could call with anything. Missing 3 bets on the river is much worse than saving yourself 1.
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Well I didn't raise the Turn either, just thought about it but thought that one bad raise per hand is enough. 
The more I look at this hand the less I like my flop raise but still not going to fold this pot and isn't it better to try to take the control from a know bluffer in SB and callers that I know offsuit highcardjunk to much?
Meh maybe not, think I got a bit overconfident on my reads of the table and played that more than my cards on the flop.
Anyone who would have raised this one pf when both the limpers are about 40% and seems not to care about position?
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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I meant to say i didnt like the flop raise.
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G_host
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 227
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by elipsesjeff
I meant to say i didnt like the flop raise.
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Oh ok, I don't either But wondering more and more if I shouldn't raised this PF with two loose callers before me.
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Romulus141
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Straight
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oxford, PA
Posts: 118
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Like everyone else said, the flop raise was unnecessary, but a call is required. With two backdoor draws (flush and straight) with a value of 1.5 outs each and two overcards that I'd put at a value of 1.5-2 outs each (since domination can come up, three outs each is just too generous I feel), that gives you somewhere between 6-7 outs, which with averaged odds gives you somewhere in the neighborhood of improving 1 out of 6 times. With pot odds offering you 1 to 19, you just can't say no.
The rest of the hand is fine.
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