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Lagging it up...

  
 
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pokerfanatic
Old 10-29-2005, 06:14 PM     Post subject: Lagging it up... #1 (permalink)  
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I just thought this hand was funny... i was at a extreamly loose table i think i was the only tight pler there... so i limped it UTG+1 knowing i'd have odds... I raised the flop in a big pot to hopefully narrow the feild some, i was trying to win this pot anyway posible

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: pkrfanatic is UTG+1 with T, A.
UTG calls, pkrfanatic calls, 1 fold, MP1 raises, 1 fold, MP3 calls, 1 fold, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, pkrfanatic 3-bets, MP1 calls, MP3 calls, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (21 SB) 4, J, 9 (7 players)
SB checks, BB bets, UTG calls, pkrfanatic raises, MP1 folds, MP3 calls, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls $2 (All-In), UTG calls.

Turn: (15.50 BB) 7 (5 players, 1 all-in)
SB checks, UTG checks, pkrfanatic checks, MP3 checks.

River: (15.50 BB) 8 (5 players, 1 all-in)
SB checks, UTG bets, pkrfanatic raises, MP3 folds, SB folds, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 19.50 BB

Results in white below:
BB has Qd Ks (high card, king).
UTG has Tc 7c (straight, jack high).
pkrfanatic has Td Ad (straight, jack high).
Outcome: UTG wins 9.75 BB. pkrfanatic wins 9.75 BB.
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jmontis
Old 10-29-2005, 06:17 PM #2 (permalink)  
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that's not really lag play, the preflop 3-bet is standard for a loose game, but the flop raise was golden, nice work.
take your ego out of the equation and judge the situation dispassionately
 
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elipsesjeff
Old 10-29-2005, 06:31 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmontis
that's not really lag play, the preflop 3-bet is standard for a loose game, but the flop raise was golden, nice work.
ur kidding, right?


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jmontis
Old 10-29-2005, 06:33 PM #4 (permalink)  
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It's not lag? or that was bad advice? when he raised the flop he was likely to get a free card on the turn

then again, I am fairly liberal with raising. I am definitely no 2+2 TAG'er
take your ego out of the equation and judge the situation dispassionately
 
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|~|ypermegachi
Old 10-29-2005, 10:54 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmontis
It's not lag? or that was bad advice? when he raised the flop he was likely to get a free card on the turn

then again, I am fairly liberal with raising. I am definitely no 2+2 TAG'er
personally i think the preflop 3 bet is a horribe play. EV wise it doesn't matter, as you are up against 6 other players so you have good equity. but raising preflop sets you up for a problem...

the pot on the flop is 21sb. that flop raise won't fold anyone. overcards, back door straights, back door flushes, any pair, all have odds to call even after the raise.

you are giving up so much postflop edge by raising preflop, that no matter what you do postflop you won't be able to make your opponent play incorrectly....and according to the FTP you're losing money.
 
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elipsesjeff
Old 10-30-2005, 12:26 AM #6 (permalink)  
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 Hyper nailed it.


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euphoricism
Old 10-30-2005, 03:54 AM #7 (permalink)  
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A) This is a bad time for a free card play. You've got nothing. Why pay to let someone else see a free card that is unlikely to help you?

B) With this many opponents, how often does the turn get donkbet anyway, rendering your flop raise entirely useless?

C) How often is your hand best on the river anyway?

Spewage dood, spewage.
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poskid_1982
Old 10-31-2005, 09:34 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Not gonna comment on PF...

But why raise the river? You have a better chance trying to catch some over callers with junk hands for more $$$. The UTG bet either has you beat or you are tied...I see no reason to chase out weaker hands and open yourself to the 3 bet should he have checked a flush on the turn or made a better str8...Especially since you said that the table is really loose.
Superb play sir...I always call 20% of my stack off with a gutshot draw. Excuse me while I race for my wallet.
 
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Fnord
Old 10-31-2005, 04:39 PM #9 (permalink)  
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The river is the worst street IMHO.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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dalecooper
Old 10-31-2005, 04:46 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Flat call the river. I agree about the pre-flop and flop raises... there's a place for lagging it up, but I don't think it really accomplished anything here apart from juicing a pot that you were runner-runner-lucky enough to take down half of.
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pokerfanatic
Old 10-31-2005, 04:49 PM #11 (permalink)  
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just another example of how to fuck up ever street in a LHE hand and still win part of the pot...
“Dream as if you’ll live forever. Live as if you’ll die today.” ~ James Dean ~

"Poker is a lot like sex, peoples perceived ability usually blinds the truth" ~ me ~

"God bless him. Got to bet big to win big! GAMB00L!!!" ~ Fnord
 
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Fnord
Old 10-31-2005, 06:03 PM #12 (permalink)  
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BTW, I open raise this UTG at ANY 10 handed table...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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elipsesjeff
Old 10-31-2005, 06:18 PM #13 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
BTW, I open raise this UTG at ANY 10 handed table...
fish


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euphoricism
Old 10-31-2005, 10:33 PM #14 (permalink)  
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I guess thats better than limp/raising it like fanatic did.

I'd prefer to open raise it, but after UTG limps, I don't mind limping behind.
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