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JJ laydown and TPTK loss

  
 
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sarbox68
Old 10-21-2006, 10:38 PM     Post subject: JJ laydown and TPTK loss #1 (permalink)  
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sarbox68
So y'all just tell me if I am overstaying my welcome and posting too much stuff...

Anyhoo....

Hand 1: Held JJ OOP against Villain. V RR PF and then R on flop. CF to him on turn, mainly because of 2 overs on board. Can't believe should have taken him to River, but should I have folded to his Flop raise with his PF RR and K on the board?

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Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.50/$1
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is UTG with J J
Hero raises, UTG+1 3-bets, 8 folds, Hero calls (6.5:1).

Flop: 9 K 5 (7.5SB, 2 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 raises, Hero calls (10.5:1).

Turn: Q (5.75BB, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: 1BB returned to UTG+1.

Results:
Final pot: 5.75BB


Hand 2: In the BB with QJs. Raised by SB PF, called by MP3 and CO. Ragged flop gives me TP w/Q Kicker. SB bets into me, I raise, everyone calls. SB checks to me on Turn, I bet, CO calls, SB folds. I bet on non-scary River, CO raises, I call. CO shows KK. Should I have a) just checked to the river (tho' no sense of strength from CO) or NOT called his River raise and folded?

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Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.50/$1
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is BB with J Q
5 folds, MP3 calls (1.5:1), CO calls (2.5:1), Button folds, SB raises, Hero calls (4.5:1), MP3 calls (5.5:1), CO calls (6.5:1).

Flop: 3 6 J (6SB, 4 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, MP3 calls (9:2), CO calls (11:2), SB calls (13:1).

Turn: 4 (7BB, 4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP3 folds, CO calls (8:1), SB folds.

River: 9 (9BB, 2 players)
Hero bets, CO raises, Hero calls (12:1).

Results:
Final pot: 13BB
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Ragnar4
Old 10-22-2006, 12:49 AM #2 (permalink)  
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Hand one.

I actually like a re-raise on the flop by the Hero here. the call/cap will tell you where your at. If he calls, you can take controll of the hand, if he re-raises, you can fold with dignity and get away from the money you lose. I'm really big on confrontations on the flop, it's just my style.

Hand 2.
CO used deception to outplay you. Seems to me like he thought the table was either being too timid, or he's retarded. I'm going with the former. Nothing you can do but put a note in CO's file that he limp called with KK, is deceptive, and keep that in mind when he's doing something that doesn't make sense.

Be glad he actually saved you money being afraid of the straight on the turn instead of turning it into a raising war. Gonna be honest, even I would have lost 3 big bets on the turn and one big bet on the river wondering what I ran into with my top pair good kicker.
The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here?
 
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NWNewell
Old 10-22-2006, 02:33 AM #3 (permalink)  
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With it being heads up preflop when it is your turn to act, I'd rather cap preflop and b/f the flop.

End result will save you one sb every time he raises the flop (cost you one more bet preflop instead of two more bets to 3-bet the flop to find out where you stand).

I think most oppoenents have to hit top pair or hold and over pair to raise the preflop capper. (They might raise with a flush draw, but any decent player has to recongize the strength of the preflop capper and know that he isn't raising a flush draw for value heads-up.... so I think many will be calling down the flush draw).

The results might not be quite as conclusive as 3-betting the flop. But I think the little less certanty is made up and more by saving a sb.

I don't know for sure... but that's what I'm thinking... I think it at least another decent way to go... maybe not better though... not really sure.
My "Operation Come Back" Thread: Interupted.
 
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arkitekton
Old 10-24-2006, 10:49 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
With it being heads up preflop when it is your turn to act, I'd rather cap preflop and b/f the flop.
Against nonmaniacs I prefer this line too. It seems to tell me what I need to know, and it has the added benefit of occasionally picking up the pot against something like a pocket pair of queens when the flop comes with an overcard--no small thing.

On Hand 2, I'm check-calling the river--but only because I went that far. There's no draw with which villain could be calling my flop raise, and would he really hang around with a hand I could beat such as JT?
Your flop raise is decent, but when all 3 opponents call, unless this is the loosest, dumbest game going, I'm check folding the turn.

And quit posting the results in your original post !!!
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