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Harry
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06-21-2006, 07:24 PM
Post subject: J3s in SB
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Philly
Posts: 722
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Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
Preflop: Hero is SB with 3 , J.
UTG calls, MP calls, 2 folds, Hero completes, BB checks.
Flop: (4 SB) 4, J , 8 (4 players)
Hero bets, BB calls, UTG raises, MP folds, Hero calls, BB calls.
Turn: (5 BB) A (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks.
River: (5 BB) K (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks.
Final Pot: 5 BB
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midas06
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: NZ
Posts: 2,196
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bet/3bet the flop. Lead the turn
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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Top Pair plus flush draw = $$ 
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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Fold Preflop. Bet/3bet the flop.
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Check out my videos at Grinderschool.com
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midas06
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: NZ
Posts: 2,196
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I thought the completion pf was marginal, but maybe just acceptable in what's going to be a 4 way pot in a 1/2 structure with people who are pretty bad postflop
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6high
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Straight
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: NZ
Posts: 136
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I think preflop was easy.
But I agree w/ a flop 3bet.
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Harry
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Full House
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Philly
Posts: 722
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Was getting 7-1 preflop, but Jeff says I need at least 9-1 to complete.
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PSU Class of 2011 weeeeeeee!
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6high
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Straight
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: NZ
Posts: 136
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Harry
Was getting 7-1 preflop, but Jeff says I need at least 9-1 to complete.
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I can't comment on Jeff's figures because I don't know where he's getting them.
You will flop a 4 flush ~ 1:8.
When you add flops like 33x, or JJx or J3x or 542 etc, I think 7:1 is pretty good. Especially when your opponents will pay off.
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midas06
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: NZ
Posts: 2,196
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Where's 9-1 come from?
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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You'll flop a four flush, according to 6 high, 1:8, but of that you'll only win 1 in 3. Roughly, you'll only hit 6% of all suited cards for flushes by the river. Throw in the other extra crap that 6high also listed and you're looking at closer to 11-1 than 9-1, but at 9-1 its a little more breakeven than it is +EV, where the higher the rake would affect your profitability.
9-1 comes from a series of statistics ihategnomes did in the winter time to effectivly cover the correct odds to play in the blinds. He never did post anything on this forum but he has talked to me "a few times" since then. I would suggest asking him and maybe he'll go into it with more depth. I guess if you really wanted to know exactly you could run a serious of PokerStove with range of hands and probabilities and stuff, but with regarding how he came to these numbers you'd have to ask him. But, I have seen his blind stats and they are pretty much perfect over a few tens of thousands of hands, so I believed him.
Considering blind play is where the majority of players have leaks at, being able to identify the correct odds per hand in multiway pot is key in having good blind numbers.
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euphoricism
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
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5:1 Suited connectors
7:1 Suited one gappers
9:1 Any two suited
I'm still wondering exactly what we need for things like offsuit connectors. No one's given me a decent answer. I've figured 9:1, but thats purely "feel", not math.
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by euphoricism
5:1 Suited connectors
7:1 Suited one gappers
9:1 Any two suited
I'm still wondering exactly what we need for things like offsuit connectors. No one's given me a decent answer. I've figured 9:1, but thats purely "feel", not math.
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Just curious as to how low you go with these requirements and how you come to that decision (comparing say 65s with T9s is what I mean by how low).
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euphoricism
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Your place or my place
Posts: 3,610
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Dont particularly care much. Higher the better.
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