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I know he got there but don't we have to pay off

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littleogre

11-12-2007, 07:07 AM Post subject: I know he got there but don't we have to pay off

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2004

Posts: 1,344

littleogre has a little shameless behaviour in the past

FullTiltPoker Game #4149138353: Table Lake Isle - $0.25/$0.50 - Limit Hold'em - 3:00:14 ET - 2007/11/12
Seat 1: HokieLegend ($14.75), is sitting out
Seat 2: lowforward ($8.30)
Seat 3: ShelyShel ($15.75)
Seat 4: littleogre ($2.35)
Seat 5: Harlequin24 ($3.20)
Seat 6: Sodapop12 ($14.55)
Seat 7: SRiverrat11 ($6.90)
Seat 8: bamboo425 ($7.30)
Seat 9: Rokchalkwatcher ($28.20)
ShelyShel posts the small blind of $0.10
littleogre has 5 seconds left to act
littleogre posts the big blind of $0.25
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to littleogre [Ad Qc]
Harlequin24 calls $0.25
Sodapop12 folds
SRiverrat11 folds
bamboo425 folds
Rokchalkwatcher folds
lowforward calls $0.25
ShelyShel calls $0.15
littleogre raises to $0.50
Harlequin24 calls $0.25
lowforward calls $0.25
ShelyShel calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [Ah 5h 4s]
ShelyShel checks
littleogre bets $0.25
Harlequin24 folds
lowforward folds
ShelyShel raises to $0.50
littleogre raises to $0.75
ShelyShel calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [Ah 5h 4s] [4c]
ShelyShel checks
littleogre bets $0.50
ShelyShel calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [Ah 5h 4s 4c] [8h]
ShelyShel bets $0.50
littleogre has 15 seconds left to act
littleogre calls $0.50

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Ragnar4

11-12-2007, 07:14 AM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: Billings, Montana

Posts: 1,284

No. You never HAVE to pay off. If you're 100% certain he got there, a fold is good.

Besides. I think he already *was* there.

The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here?

Jibalob

11-12-2007, 08:09 AM

#3 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2007

Location: Out of my roll

Posts: 512

Obv depends on villain, I have alot of players in my db who will take a stab here with any ace, and others who will never ever donk the river except for value.

I personally think you are easily beaten here often enough to fold.

The only time I pay off here when I think I'm behind is very early during a session (maybe the first orbit or two) to let the table know I'm not going to fold every time someone donk-reps a completed draw.

PLEASE READ ULTIMATE BET THREAD IN "ONLINE POKER ROOMS" FORUM
Wait, this is .05/.10 and you got sexied, I can't believe that shit, limit must really be dying.[/quote]

littleogre

11-12-2007, 08:11 AM

#4 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2004

Posts: 1,344

more like 99% but you get my point. Once he called my reraise on the flop then just called my turn bet i felt very strongly that he had a flush draw. A hand like 2 pair or a set is usually gonna lead out or c-r the turn. Then his bingo card hits on the river but when he beats we are geting almost 10-1 and according to lots of limit books that i have read folding for 1 bet on the river in a large pot is hardly ever right.

Jibalob

11-12-2007, 08:22 AM

#5 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2007

Location: Out of my roll

Posts: 512

Quote:

Originally Posted by littleogre

folding for 1 bet on the river in a large pot is hardly ever right.

If you are 99% sure you are right about behing beat you need 100:1

(OK, slight overkill but you get the drift)

PLEASE READ ULTIMATE BET THREAD IN "ONLINE POKER ROOMS" FORUM
Wait, this is .05/.10 and you got sexied, I can't believe that shit, limit must really be dying.[/quote]

littleogre

11-12-2007, 09:58 AM

#6 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2004

Posts: 1,344

Also don't we have to be concerned about image? I mean beting and raising through the entire hand then folding for 1river bet is gonna make you look mighty weak.

Jibalob

11-12-2007, 10:51 AM

#7 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2007

Location: Out of my roll

Posts: 512

Quote:

Originally Posted by littleogre

Also don't we have to be concerned about image?

In a typical .25/.50 you dont really have an image to be brutally honest. "Besides, it doesnt matter what your image is as long as you can exploit it).

As I think I've said in another thread, IMO calling here is fine early in a session to let people know you arent folding every time someone bets a scare card but if you keep calling these spots then you're just throwing money away.

PLEASE READ ULTIMATE BET THREAD IN "ONLINE POKER ROOMS" FORUM
Wait, this is .05/.10 and you got sexied, I can't believe that shit, limit must really be dying.[/quote]

DrivingDog

11-12-2007, 11:39 AM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2007

Location: UK

Posts: 923

For all your opponent knows, YOU just got there. He's not betting anything that doesn't beat TP. Unless you have a specific read that he's liable to bluff here, a fold is correct, imo.

I see you raised big offsuit cards oop with multiple opponents. What's your plan if you miss the flop?

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on." (George Bush).

KoRnholio

11-12-2007, 06:41 PM

#9 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2005

Posts: 2,165

KoRnholio will become famous soon enough

Spots like this I just pay off unless the villain is a super rock/calling station who only bets the goods.

Some days it feels like I've been standing forever, waiting for the bank teller to return so I can cash in all these Sklansky Bucks.

bigspenda73

11-12-2007, 07:26 PM

#10 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jul 2006

Location: Pwnsylvania

Posts: 7,545

bigspenda73 will become famous soon enough

This decision is between raise/call and folding is never an option.

If you ever think about making a fold for 1 bet in a pot this big you really do not understand the math/pot odds of the game.

He has Ax just as much if not more than a flush draw. Also, make sure you noted how he/she played a draw if they did show up with one.

DrivingDog

11-12-2007, 10:55 PM

#11 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2007

Location: UK

Posts: 923

If it was a higher limit i'd definitely call but at this level most players don't bluff and if they do it's in a spot in which a bluff makes no sense at all.

I expect Villian to have us beat here more than 90% of the time...and he's not expecting you to fold your Ace. He wants a call.

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on." (George Bush).

bigspenda73

11-12-2007, 11:12 PM

#12 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jul 2006

Location: Pwnsylvania

Posts: 7,545

Even if he has us beat 90% of the time it's still a profitable call!!!

DrivingDog

11-13-2007, 12:02 AM

#13 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2007

Location: UK

Posts: 923

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrivingDog

I expect Villian to have us beat here more than 90% of the time.

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and those are the ones you want to concentrate on." (George Bush).

Fnord

11-13-2007, 12:05 AM

#14 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

I pay-off this river because I'm a pay-off bitch.

Consider checking pre-flop.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

bigspenda73

11-13-2007, 12:05 AM

#15 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jul 2006

Location: Pwnsylvania

Posts: 7,545

ok...fold

have fun losing money

littleogre

11-13-2007, 12:42 AM

#16 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2004

Posts: 1,344

I pay off villan shows 6/7 of hearts

Hermann the Lombard

11-13-2007, 05:09 PM

#17 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2007

Posts: 270

Quote:

Originally Posted by littleogre

I pay off villan shows 6/7 of hearts

I feel your pain.

Maybe you're being a touch "results-oriented" here. I'm not 90% certain that we're beaten more than 90% of the time, so I'm going to call here...and make a note.

(Now I only have to get my notes file fixed so that I have notes from previous sessions again. They're not properly converted to Unicode so I can make notes but they aren't available after the current session!)

Oh, no! Not another learning experience!

mk84

11-29-2007, 06:03 PM

#18 (permalink)

Guest

Posts: n/a

NO SLOW PLAY

pokerfanatic

11-29-2007, 06:24 PM

#19 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2004

Location: 6max limit tables

Posts: 1,968

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

I pay-off this river because I'm a pay-off bitch.

Consider checking pre-flop.

yea i agree your raise gets pot out of control plus you have no extra fold equity imidatly and the fold equity you would have has now reduced post flop due to the size of the pot...

“Dream as if you’ll live forever. Live as if you’ll die today.” ~ James Dean ~

"Poker is a lot like sex, peoples perceived ability usually blinds the truth" ~ me ~

"God bless him. Got to bet big to win big! GAMB00L!!!" ~ Fnord

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