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I always lose money short-handed

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08-08-2005, 09:31 PM Post subject: I always lose money short-handed

#1 (permalink)

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When it's a full table I usually wait for hands like wired pairs of nines or higher or hands like KTs or better

The lowest ace I play is A9, and that's in unraised pots hoping to maybe flop two pair or an ace that didn't help anyone else
In the long run that's probably profitable on tables where people play any ace since 9 is the median kicker

But when it gets short-handed, like 4 or 5 people, I don't know what hands to play. When I get JTo I feel like it's a good enough hand to call a raise with once I limped. Should I even play JTo 5-handed?

I don't know what good starting hands are, and when I make a pair of tens with a jack kicker I feel like it's a good hand, call down to the end just to find that I've been beat by QT...

What kind of hands should I wait for 5 or 4 handed? Is any ace good enough to raise?

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TylerK

08-08-2005, 09:55 PM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Oct 2004

Location: PEANUT BUTTER JELLY TIME

Posts: 1,791

Your strategy seems to have a lot of limping and calling in it, which is probably most of the problem.

TylerK: its just gambling if i want to worry about money i'll go to work lol

Fnord

08-08-2005, 10:01 PM

#3 (permalink)

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Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

Your too tight + passive and are only beating full ring (or have the illusion of doing so) because your opposition is probably horrible. In a short-handed environment you'll end up in more 3 or less way pots (by pure viture of less suckers to limp) where your lack of gamble + aggression is costing too much money.

I hear pocket eights is a good hand too, gamble it up and play it next time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Nehmer

08-08-2005, 10:04 PM

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Oct 2004

Location: Decatur, IL

Posts: 666

Quote:

Originally Posted by TylerK

Your strategy seems to have a lot of limping and calling in it, which is probably most of the problem.

Yep, once it gets down to 6 or fewer people, you should never be limping as the first one in the pot and should probably never be cold calling raises and instead be folding or reraising.

As for what hands are worth raising, I tend to raise A8o or better and any suited ace, K9o or better and K7s or better, and then any combination of face cards, and any pair above 5s from EP. Then from the button/CO, I'll raise basically any ace and any pocket pair and keep everything else about the same. Then If the BB is a player that folds his blinds especially easily and SB is somewhat tight, I'll be raising almost everything from the button if folded to me.

08-08-2005, 11:01 PM

#5 (permalink)

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I don't limp as first one usually. But seriuosly, these people raise with anything that seems good.

Then they bet and raise on the flop, same on the turn, etc.
I can't hit every flop

I guess my weakness is in trying to raise as a bluff and getting reraised as a bluff OR when they have third button

At a full table I can really wait for a good hand, raise with it preflop and reraise with it preflop if needed. Then I can still let it go if I don't hit the flop. But I can't wait for two big cards 3 handed, can I? That means I'll be REALLY hitting the flop only what 18% of the time?

The leak I found was calling with too many hands preflop when they have almost no chance to get a great hand on the flop that I can call down to the river with.

Plus, what do I do with a pair of sevens? No matter what, they will bet the flop, the turn and the river. Can I call down with overcards?

EDIT: just got pocket tens, bet on each round, three overcards, someone caught one of them

just got pocket nines, two overcards, bet on the flop, bet on the turn, check the river
took the pot

just got pair of fives
raised pf
one overcard flop
someone bets I raise
king on the turn
someone bets I raise
he threebets
I fold :/

table is now 7handed
I got AQs
raised preflop
all rags
6 people in the hand
I check and then fold to a bet

they call me if I bet, but if it's checked the last guy always bets

I lost like 25BB trying to bet without a hand
well I had to fold when they raise me with the third button since I have nothing :/

Holy crap
the game got full
I got a full house
and quads
15B and 25BB pots
I'm back up

Hmm I'm just going to wait for the nuts at these tables
since they cap the pot with just a pair

I can't wait for the nuts shorthanded T.T
Hell, I'll take three of a kind / straight / flush even if it's not the nuts against these people
and I DO raise crazy when I get something
and they DO raise me back when they have something

08-09-2005, 12:21 AM

#6 (permalink)

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7 handed
QJs
call a pf raise in late position
flop two pair
flop is capped
I threebet turn
he calls

by the river I get a queen high flush
win pot

oh snap
they're onto me
I flop top pair no kicker (tens)
after I bet on the turn everyone folds!

what the hell
the table's gotten tighter than *include sexual reference to babies*

Fnord

08-09-2005, 01:20 AM

#7 (permalink)

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Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Quote:

Originally Posted by iopq

table is now 7handed
I got AQs
raised preflop
all rags
6 people in the hand
I check and then fold to a bet

Pot is too big to fold for one small bet, particularly with a back door nut flush draw. You'll check fold the turn a lot, but do the math...

Quote:

Originally Posted by iopq

they call me if I bet, but if it's checked the last guy always bets

Check/raise out of position and be more inclined to take free cards (or set-up free cards) in position.

Bluff less and learn to play more hands. Mix in more selective bluffs after establishing a tight table image (live games.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by iopq

what the hell
the table's gotten tighter than *include sexual reference to babies*

Great players know when to change gears...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

08-09-2005, 01:29 AM

#8 (permalink)

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Posts: n/a

Yep, changed gears and now all the players changed! I won exactly 5 SB being aggressive.
EDIT: Kick ass! 8.5 SB more being aggressive!
3 more SB!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I was trying to advertise and it automucked me!!!

And I didn't have no backdoor flush draw with AQs
I mean, I didn't have anything at all
except for a pair draw :/

Here is a reliable tell I'm beat if I don't have it:

when they click "raise anything" button

OMFG!! OMFG!!! I had the nut flush and he bet the river

(4 clubs on board he has one too)
I say "stop bluffing!!"
I raise
he 3 bets
I cap
he calls LOL

THANK YOU FTR FORUMS

edit: pair of aces,
I bet preflop
two callers
I bet on the flop
two callers
card pairs the flop
I bet the turn
guy raises me
I call
then I call on the river... I thought he had trips but I needed to know for sure for only 1 BB
actually if you think about it if I folded the turn it would be 2BB

should I fold two aces on the turn if the third card pairs?

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