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Help a limit newb- Stars .25/.50 hands

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zachaser

08-09-2008, 10:41 PM Post subject: Help a limit newb- Stars .25/.50 hands

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2007

Posts: 219

What's up guys, been playing on Stars for a year and a half, gotten tired of SNG's and want to learn limit. I've read the digests here, and some from other sites as well, and I've got Ed Miller's book on the way. Based on everything I've read, it seems like it's almost always good to bet after raising PF, and to checkraise in spots where you have a good draw/can trap money in with a good hand. Anyways, here are a few hands:

Hand 1 --> No reads on villain.
PokerStars Game #19488912513: Hold'em Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/09 - 16:40:32 (ET)
Table 'Menkib' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: Gruposim ($13.45 in chips)
Seat 2: Öljehult ($10 in chips)
Seat 3: brammiej ($10.05 in chips)
Seat 4: missroxy_514 ($5 in chips)
Seat 5: zachaser ($13.55 in chips)
Seat 6: RoxyRuss ($2.80 in chips)
Gruposim: posts small blind $0.10
Öljehult: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to zachaser [Jc Ah]
brammiej: folds
missroxy_514: folds
zachaser: raises $0.25 to $0.50
RoxyRuss: raises $0.25 to $0.75
Gruposim: folds
Öljehult: calls $0.50
missroxy_514 is sitting out
zachaser: raises $0.25 to $1
Betting is capped
RoxyRuss: calls $0.25
Öljehult: calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [Td 4c Js]
missroxy_514 leaves the table
Öljehult: checks
zachaser: bets $0.25
RoxyRuss: calls $0.25
Öljehult: calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [Td 4c Js] [9s]
Öljehult: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50
RoxyRuss: folds
Öljehult: calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [Td 4c Js 9s] [2h]
Öljehult: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50

Hand 2--> No reads again.
PokerStars Game #19488960183: Hold'em Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/09 - 16:42:22 (ET)
Table 'Menkib' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Gruposim ($13.35 in chips)
Seat 2: Öljehult ($7.40 in chips)
Seat 3: brammiej ($12.55 in chips)
Seat 5: zachaser ($16.20 in chips)
Zzoop will be allowed to play after the button
zachaser: posts small blind $0.10
Gruposim: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to zachaser [Jc 7c]
Öljehult: folds
brammiej: folds
zachaser: raises $0.25 to $0.50--> Is it bad to try and steal from SB in these spots?
Gruposim: calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [6h 9c Kd]
zachaser: bets $0.25
Gruposim: calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [6h 9c Kd] [2h]
zachaser: checks
Gruposim: bets $0.50
zachaser: folds

Hand 3
PokerStars Game #19489083236: Hold'em Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/09 - 16:47:06 (ET)
Table 'Menkib' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: Gruposim ($11.15 in chips)
Seat 2: Öljehult ($9.85 in chips)
Seat 3: brammiej ($13.80 in chips)
Seat 5: zachaser ($15.40 in chips)
Seat 6: JoiseyGal ($2 in chips)
JoiseyGal: posts small blind $0.10
Gruposim: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to zachaser [9d Td]
Öljehult: folds
JoiseyGal said, "nh"
brammiej: calls $0.25
zachaser: calls $0.25
JoiseyGal: folds
Gruposim: checks
*** FLOP *** [4h 9c Jh]
Öljehult said, "ty"
Gruposim: checks
brammiej: bets $0.25
zachaser: calls $0.25
Gruposim: folds
*** TURN *** [4h 9c Jh] [8c]
brammiej: bets $0.50
zachaser: raises $0.50 to $1
brammiej: calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [4h 9c Jh 8c] [5h]
brammiej: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50

Hand 4
PokerStars Game #19489441985: Hold'em Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/09 - 17:01:04 (ET)
Table 'Menkib' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: wthall ($10.95 in chips)
Seat 3: john g 1209 ($14.20 in chips)
Seat 4: z63by31 ($16 in chips)
Seat 5: zachaser ($15.55 in chips)
Seat 6: JoiseyGal ($5.15 in chips)
JoiseyGal: posts small blind $0.10
wthall: posts big blind $0.25
Billion$Guy: sits out
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to zachaser [Qd Ks]
john g 1209: folds
z63by31: folds
zachaser: raises $0.25 to $0.50
JoiseyGal: calls $0.40
wthall: calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [Jh 9c Ah]
JoiseyGal: checks
wthall: checks
zachaser: bets $0.25
JoiseyGal: folds
wthall: calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [Jh 9c Ah] [Qc]
wthall: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50
wthall: calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [Jh 9c Ah Qc] [7h]
wthall: checks
zachaser: checks

Hand 5 --> Deekou was a complete calling station, he had called bets all the way down with Ace high twice in raised pots with scary boards. In this hand I thought I was betting for value.
PokerStars Game #19489283460: Hold'em Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/09 - 16:54:52 (ET)
Table 'Itzigsohn' 6-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: g-birdie ($4.90 in chips)
Seat 2: zachaser ($14.55 in chips)
Seat 3: Deekou ($14.30 in chips)
Seat 4: supreme84 ($12.25 in chips)
Seat 6: azores76 ($10.15 in chips)
Deekou: posts small blind $0.10
supreme84: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to zachaser [4d 4s]
azores76: folds
g-birdie: folds
zachaser: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Deekou: calls $0.40
supreme84: folds
*** FLOP *** [8s 6c 9d]
Joshd866 is disconnected
Deekou: checks
zachaser: bets $0.25
Deekou: calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [8s 6c 9d] [Ah]
Deekou: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50
Deekou: calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [8s 6c 9d Ah] [Jh]
Deekou: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50

Hand 6

PokerStars Game #19489338315: Hold'em Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2008/08/09 - 16:57:00 (ET)
Table 'Itzigsohn' 6-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: g-birdie ($5.70 in chips)
Seat 2: zachaser ($12.95 in chips)
Seat 3: Deekou ($15.65 in chips)
Seat 4: supreme84 ($11.90 in chips)
Seat 6: azores76 ($10.15 in chips)
Deekou: posts small blind $0.10
supreme84: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to zachaser [Qh Ah]
azores76: folds
Joshd866 is disconnected
g-birdie: calls $0.25
zachaser: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Deekou: folds
supreme84: folds
g-birdie: calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [Js 7c Qc]
g-birdie: checks
zachaser: bets $0.25
g-birdie: calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [Js 7c Qc] [Tc]
g-birdie: checks
zachaser: bets $0.50
g-birdie: raises $0.50 to $1
Joshd866 is connected
zachaser: calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [Js 7c Qc Tc] [5h]
g-birdie: bets $0.50
zachaser: calls $0.50

Thanks guys!

Chase

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kettleofish

08-09-2008, 11:24 PM

#2 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2007

Location: Helllllo Richard

Posts: 333

Without reads i play all of these the same, except hand 5. DO NOT TRY AND BLUFF CALLING STATIONS IN LHE. U don't beat anything here, check behind and save yourself a bet. I wouldn't even bet the turn.

Some people will also no doubt tell u that limping the button is a sin, a la hand 3, but i don't mind it.

P.S Reads are your friend in LHE. U will be able to make the corect decision much more easily with a few good reads. Except for hand 5, obv

There's only one system. Bet. Lose. Borrow. Steal. Lose. Take the drugs. Lose. Prison. Death.

Chopper

08-10-2008, 02:40 AM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

assume they are calling stations, and passive, until proven otherwise at these stakes. dont do a lot of bluffing without "8+ outs." however, scare cards can really be your friend.

now, when you see a guy getting aggro, use that against him with c/r's and calldowns. you will c/r in LHE much more often than NL.

start putting players on ranges, and start practicing calculating how many combinations of those you beat and how many beat you. read this for help on that. http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...00.html#641136

most importantly, imo, read Hyper's guide about 10 more times. and remember, Miller's book was more of a FR book. the sequel, HEFAP, has a great short-handed section in it. but, you may want to target some books aimed more at 6max play if thats where you are planning on staying.

you will be amazed at how this helps your SNG games. glad to have you here.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Chopper

08-10-2008, 02:55 AM

#4 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

to your hands...

i am not capping AJo in hand one. the threat of domination, and being oop, is too costly at these stakes, imo. the rest is ok. i dont stop firing until i get raised in 6max most times.

absolutely steal from the SB in ALL spots. you need to steal like a muther in 6max games because the blinds swing around so often. AND, most importantly, at these stakes, they dont know how to defend. pick them off at every opportunity! notice he fired when he was checked to? use that against them when you have a hand.

if CO open limps, i and i have a hand worth stealing blinds with, i raise him to isolate. i dont limp behind unless there are two limpers or the blinds are really loose. in other words, with no reads, RAISE THAT BTN. i also raise the flop if that blind is loose. i want initiative for a free card on the turn...or the option to bet the turn and take the free SD.

four looks good.

five...you werent betting for value here. if he calls with Ahi, he likely calls with any pair, too. you have bottom pair in the hole. not a good betting hand when you know villain is going to SD.

six is fine, but you probably lost. the c/r on the turn is a pretty strong move. i find most times TP isnt good anymore when i get one of those in the face. but, i still dont fold TPTK most times, unless villain is passive. but, i rarely expect to win, too.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

socal1111

08-10-2008, 08:27 PM

#5 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jun 2008

Posts: 191

Gr8 to have you!

Maybe it's just me, but I can't go thru all those hands at one time. Would it be possible to just post 1 (maybe 2) hands at a time?

Good luck improving! That's all we can ever do in this game.

"We don't stop playing because we get old. We get old because we stop playing!" -Doyle

zachaser

08-10-2008, 08:56 PM

#6 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2007

Posts: 219

Thanks for the replies guys, they were very helpful.

Socal: Come on, it's only 6 hands! You should see the SNG forums...

Also guys, I've read that 300 bb is a good measure for what level you should play. I've got $900 in my Poker Stars account, I was thinking about trying .50/1 or 1/2. Any advice appreciated!

Chase

Chopper

08-10-2008, 10:21 PM

#7 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by socal1111

c'mon, dude. you can always open a notepad doc and shoot comments as you read through the HHs...then, copy/paste it in. one to two hands at a time, unless they are really thought provoking (which most are not), leads to shitloads of threads that last about a day and a half.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

Chopper

08-10-2008, 10:25 PM

#8 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by zachaser

Also guys, I've read that 300 bb is a good measure for what level you should play.

not for 6max. you need about 500 bb's...minimum. but, it really all comes down to your personal risk for ruin.

however, one approach i really like is DrivingDog's. play with a minimum of 150 BB's for the highest level you will play, but table select well and play a variety of levels. if you are just one level below your max, you will be rolled properly, and a lot of times you will be TWO levels below, therefore, overrolled.

change that for 6max to 250BB's, and, bingo. you have your bankroll management issue solved.

300ish for FR. 500ish for 6max. tailor it to your risk factor/nittyness, and you never need to think about it again.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

zachaser

08-11-2008, 12:03 AM

#9 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Mar 2007

Posts: 219

Quote:

not for 6max. you need about 500 bb's...minimum. but, it really all comes down to your personal risk for ruin.

Well, that's settled. I will play at .5/1 on Stars since I have enough cushion to learn the game. How many hands are a good enough sample to evaluate to consider moving up?

Chase

kettleofish

08-11-2008, 01:47 AM

#10 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: May 2007

Location: Helllllo Richard

Posts: 333

Ya, definitely play .5/1 if u have a $900 roll, u are losing urself monies by only playing .25/50. The play isn't any better. In my opinion, naturally

I dunno how many hands is a good enough sample size regarding moving up. 20K? That figures pulled right outta my cadbury's corridor though. Personally, i'd be giving 1/2 a whirl as soon as my roll hit $1000.

There's only one system. Bet. Lose. Borrow. Steal. Lose. Take the drugs. Lose. Prison. Death.

Chopper

08-11-2008, 03:05 AM

#11 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: St. Louis, MO

Posts: 4,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by zachaser

Quote:

not for 6max. you need about 500 bb's...minimum. but, it really all comes down to your personal risk for ruin.

Well, that's settled. I will play at .5/1 on Stars since I have enough cushion to learn the game. How many hands are a good enough sample to evaluate to consider moving up?

jeff will jump in and correct me if i am wrong, but i wouldnt look at much less than 25k. but, if you follow the guidelines i laid out for playing a different level, you will be "taking shots" asap.

LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.

Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!

arborman

08-11-2008, 08:12 PM

#12 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2007

Posts: 300

Taking shots and moving up really depends on when you are comfortable enough to lose chips on correct plays. If you are playing passively because the bet size makes you nervous, you are out of your level and going to lose. If you are spewing chips because the bets are chumpchange (I can't play .02-.04 anymore), then you are under your level.

Personally I pick tables between 3 levels - $.25-.5 up to $1-2, with a 400bb roll for the top level (I cash out regularly to keep myself interested). I play 4 tables, and pick $1-2 tables first, then work my way down until I have 4 good tables. It's good to have some chips at a couple of sites so you can be sure to have all good tables...

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