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Iwind
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01-22-2006, 07:55 PM
Post subject: Hand from 1/2
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Norway
Posts: 436
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I'm very new to limit, have only been playing for a couple of days while reading some guides and most of SSH, wich I found to be a great book.
Anyways, playing draws is something I'm not completely sure how to do, as far as I've understood, building pots with a strong draw like here with multiple people in the pot is a good thing. That's why I check-raised the turn, to make all stay in the hand.
Here I don't think hitting a queen will win me the pot, so there is no need to try to make the others fold, if I hit my flush or straight I'll win the pot.
Does my thinking/play here make sense?
PokerRoom 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx
Preflop: Hero is MP3 with 9 , Q. CO posts a blind of $1.
3 folds, MP2 calls, Hero calls, CO (poster) checks, 1 fold, SB completes, BB checks.
Flop: (5 SB) J , 8, 2 (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP2 checks, Hero bets, CO raises, SB calls, BB folds, MP2 calls, Hero 3-bets, CO caps, SB calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls.
Turn: (10.50 BB) 6 (4 players)
SB checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks, CO bets, SB calls, MP2 calls, Hero raises, CO calls, SB calls, MP2 calls.
River: (18.50 BB) 4 (4 players)
SB checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks, CO bets, SB folds, MP2 calls, Hero folds.
Final Pot: 20.50 BB
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Shark Bait
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 481
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I don't really mind the 3 bet on the flop with something like 13 outs, but I don't see how check raising the turn helps you, especially when you don't make your draw like what happened.
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<a500lbgorilla> Limit is poker with training wheels!
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Xanadu
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Full House
Join Date: May 2005
Location: st. paul, MO
Posts: 966
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with 12 outs and 3 others in the pot, the turn raise probably at best increases variance once you take away part of an out for someone possibly having a higher flush. Better chance than usual that someone else is chasing the flush too with the action ... weakening your draw slightly. You need another person in the pot to make this raise profitable. And if the CO 3-bets the turn and chases one or two out, you just lost money. On the plus side, the check-raise may increase your chance of getting paid off if you hit your draw. The raise may not be -EV but I estimate it probably is slightly -EV. The big thing is to realize that you never make this play with a 3-way pot, and almost always do in a 5-way pot.
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Demiparadigm
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Xanadu
The big thing is to realize that you never make this play with a 3-way pot, and almost always do in a 5-way pot.
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yepyep.
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To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.
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Iwind
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Norway
Posts: 436
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Yeah, I get what you're saying, and after reading the posts I agree calling would be the better move on the turn. The others might have been chasing a flush or a straight after all, so I should take away a few outs. I'd never make this play in a 3-way pot, and as it looks here probably not in this 4-way pot either, but will use it in 5-way pots then, even though I've not been in too many of those yet
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Iwind
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Norway
Posts: 436
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And another thing, on the flop my pot equity is like 45% assuming 12 outs, it's four handed, and with such an edge I should pump the pot, like I did. Apart from pumping the pot it also gives me odds for calling a bigger bet on the turn. However, at the turn when my draw doesn't hit my pot equity is reduced, I don't really have an edge anymore so I should just call. Does this reasoning make sense?
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euphoricism
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Your place or my place
Posts: 3,610
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Thats pretty much exactly it, wind.
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