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Fix my QJ.

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euphoricism

06-23-2006, 08:04 AM Post subject: Fix my QJ.

#1 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Your place or my place

Posts: 3,610

Going through PT for the month, QJo and QJs are two hands that should be positive that happen to be my biggest losers, totalling -$875 whereas for the month I'm -$2000. Almost a full half of my losses are from QJ. That is absolutely disgustingly nasty.

So obviously I'm pouring money out of my ass with this hand -- and $581 of the -$875 is from the blinds, so that is my concern right now. So lets a few hypotheticals, concentrating on the preflop from the blinds for the moment, then some specific hands at the end.

A) We're in the small blind with QJo, limper from MP. Whatchado? Complete? Raise? Fold?
B) Same situation, but now there are two limpers.
C) Few limpers and a button raise.. e.g. UTG calls, 1
fold, CO calls, Button raises, Hero ... ?

Ok now some big blind questions

D) Folded to the button who raises. Small blind calls. Watchagonnado?
E) Folded to the small blind who completes. This one is probably too highly dependent on what we think of SB, but in general -- raise or check?
F) One limper, folded to you on the BB. Raise or check?

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euphoricism

06-23-2006, 08:15 AM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Your place or my place

Posts: 3,610

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is MP with J

, Q

.
1 fold, Hero raises, CO calls, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 7

, 5

, Q

(4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets, CO calls, SB folds, BB calls.

Turn: (5.50 BB) T

(3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, CO calls, BB calls.

River: (8.50 BB) K

(3 players)
BB checks, Hero checks, CO bets, BB calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 11.50 BB

<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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euphoricism

06-23-2006, 08:19 AM

#3 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Your place or my place

Posts: 3,610

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (4 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q

, J

.
Hero raises, 2 folds, BB 3-bets, Hero calls.

Flop: (6.40 SB) 6

, T

, J

(2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (4.20 BB) 4

(2 players)
BB bets, Hero raises, BB calls.

River: (8.20 BB) 8

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB calls.

Final Pot: 10.20 BB

<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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Hate

06-23-2006, 08:31 AM

#4 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jul 2005

Posts: 322

A) We're in the small blind with QJo, limper from MP. Whatchado? Complete? Raise? Fold? call
B) Same situation, but now there are two limpers. call
C) Few limpers and a button raise.. e.g. UTG calls, 1
fold, CO calls, Button raises, Hero ... ? fold

Ok now some big blind questions

D) Folded to the button who raises. Small blind calls. Watchagonnado? call.odds
E) Folded to the small blind who completes. This one is probably too highly dependent on what we think of SB, but in general -- raise or check? raise
F) One limper, folded to you on the BB. Raise or check? depending on limper I might raise.but mostly check

Hand1: Why call that river? If it was HU, yeah, maybe, since it's 5/10 there's second level thinking and all that. But you've already got one call behind you. Why call 2nd pair good kicker on a 3str8, 3flush board? If it was TP, yeah, i'd call. But not with 2nd. Too many hands beat you.

Hand 2: Goot

also keep in mind the highest i've ever played was 2/4 (well, 243 hands of it anyway).

midas06

06-23-2006, 10:03 AM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: NZ

Posts: 2,196

A) I generally raise
B) Call
C) fold

D) Call
E) Raise
F) Depends on the position of the limper and who it is.

euphoricism

06-23-2006, 12:35 PM

#6 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Your place or my place

Posts: 3,610

for C) does it change between QJo and QJs (I think it does, but don't listen to me, I'm losing my ass

)

<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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outphase

06-23-2006, 01:31 PM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Apr 2005

Posts: 949

in Hand 1 you have the immediate pot odds to make the call, but can you really make the overcall when there are now straights, flushes and an overcard?

hand 2 looked like blind steal/defense

Quote:

Originally Posted by lambchopdc

Lets stop talking ABC poker and move on to D, E, and F.

Harry

06-23-2006, 03:43 PM

#8 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2006

Location: Philly

Posts: 722

When facing no agression PF I like to raise so I can c-bet it. So when everyone folds to SB who completes or one limper or so I like to raise PF. Against agression PF I am learning to fold because it seems to be behind so often (unless the raiser has a large PFR range.)

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Ltrain

06-23-2006, 05:04 PM

#9 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2005

Location: Miami, Florida

Posts: 514

A. Depends on BB
B. Call
C. Fold
D. Call
E. Raise
F. Check
Hand 1, fold the river after the overcall
Hand 2, OK, but I like a river raise against probable Ace high, and he should call your river raise with a naked ace. Also, Q,Q-A,A will almost never 3-bet a river raise.

"Don't judge a man until you have walked a mile in his shoes. Then you are a mile away, and have his shoes." - Anon.

Xanadu

06-23-2006, 06:16 PM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: st. paul, MO

Posts: 966

Hmm, overall, looks like you are too aggressive, your vpip and pfr for these hands seem a little high. In general, I like to fold QJo UTG +1, and open-raise from CO. I fold QJo outside the blinds if there have been any limpers (of course iso-raise 1 very loose player). QJs, I would open raise from any position, probably limp it if there are limpers already. Fold both to any raise when I am outside the blinds unless UTG raises, and 2 cold calls, then cold call. SB, I fold QJo to any raise, unless a very aggressive blind stealer, then raise, and always complete. SB, QJs generally call a raise, and 3-bet a button raise. BB, I'll call raises with both, and 3-bet a blind steal with QJs, and occassionally with QJ.

spoonitnow

06-24-2006, 03:31 PM Post subject: Re: Fix my QJ.

#11 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: IRC Chat Room

Posts: 5,406

A) We're in the small blind with QJo, limper from MP. Whatchado? Complete? Raise? Fold? Raise unless it's extremely unlikely BB will fold
B) Same situation, but now there are two limpers. Call
C) Few limpers and a button raise.. e.g. UTG calls, 1
fold, CO calls, Button raises, Hero ... ? Fold QJo, call (I feel dirty for even saying the word "call") QJs if all limpers are really passive
D) Folded to the button who raises. Small blind calls. Watchagonnado? Call
E) Folded to the small blind who completes. This one is probably too highly dependent on what we think of SB, but in general -- raise or check? Raise unless I think SB is being tricky, and especially if I have a good chance of taking it on the flop if regardless of the cards
F) One limper, folded to you on the BB. Raise or check? Probably raise if limper was OTB, check otherwise

elipsesjeff

06-24-2006, 03:42 PM

#12 (permalink)

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Location: Northern Virginia

Posts: 4,900

elipsesjeff is an unknown quantity at this point

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hate

I agree 100% with about everything he said. So much so I am too lazy to actually fix anything that I would maybe kinda disagree about.

QJo sucks ass, seriously. I fold it UTG regularly on most tables and won't raise with it if there are 2 limpers in front of me. I will isoraise with it a lot but that really is about it. Blind play is a bit diferent, but frankly you should never call a raise from the SB with this nasty hand, and I would 3bet it in defense. You're right, QJs is a MUCH stronger hand and you should be playing it a lot more, either coldcalling if you have to or flat out more aggressive compared to your opponent.

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Hate

06-24-2006, 04:27 PM

#13 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jul 2005

Posts: 322

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