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Kijjo
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03-08-2009, 04:43 AM
Post subject: Ez Razz question
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 554
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I was wondering what a good winrate and what a decent winrate at razz ring games are on the micros and low stakes.
I've just been goofing around with the micros and found them really soft, was wondering what's considered good.
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Donk Skills:
#1 The bluff call
#2 The Drawing-Dead Value Bet
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"What we do in life echoes in eternity."
Maximus Decimus Meridius - Gladiator
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TLR
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,007
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No idea
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lshion
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03-10-2009, 08:49 PM
Post subject: Razz ?
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#3 (permalink)
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High Card
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 7
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Neither one, their both bad calls.
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oskar
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
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I don't know... the problem with Razz and Stud is mostly that you need superhuman memory to play 4 or more tables. I only play them in HORSE games so I have no freakin clue what my winrate is. I try to avoid them frankly. For any single table you should be able to get a better winrate than in LHE Just because the only people who enjoy it are degenerate gamblers.
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gn2056
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Long Beach, California
Posts: 36
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Oskar makes a good point about multi-tabling, I am not big on multi-tabling maybe two if im on low limits or tourney. I really dont play ring game razz, but I enjoy the tourneys and thats probably the way to go with razz. Theres a lot of bad players in the tourneys I would imagine the ring games would probably have the best players.
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I would rather have a bottle in front of me then a frontal labotomy
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Kijjo
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 554
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I agree that the tourneys have pitiful players, but I don't have the time very often to sit and grind out a huge field in a limit MTT. Wish the SnGs would get some action, but never seem to.
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Donk Skills:
#1 The bluff call
#2 The Drawing-Dead Value Bet
__________________________________________________ _____________
"What we do in life echoes in eternity."
Maximus Decimus Meridius - Gladiator
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OneEyeLefty
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Straight
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: In the batter's box. Already 0-1 count....
Posts: 125
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These games are for card counters and players with great memories. It's hard to multi-table stud but razz shouldn't be a problem. Alot of people jump over from NLHE thinking they can play but they always overvalue their hands.
Lefty
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Careful what you wish for.....you just may get it!
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Chopper
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 4,255
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i cant help with a winrate, either, but i do disagree with the "degenerate gambooler" comment.
if the games are super soft, which these appear to be, i think it's foolish not to look into them.....therefore, i am. not because i need GA, but because i like to win in soft games.
why not play the games you multi-table, if you play rings, and open one razz up on the side? i am doing that with my LHE tables right now, and it isnt causing me any problems. but, i dont 10-table, either.
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LHE is a game where your skill keeps you breakeven until you hit your rush of random BS.
Nothing beats flopping quads while dropping a duece!
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TLR
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,007
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It is much harder to multitable razz (or any stud game) then it is to multitable omaha, from winrate point of view your winrate much be higher enough to compensate for the reductio in the number of table
IMO multitabling is tougher because of two main factors - the first and most obvious is that you have to keep track of a lot more info - exposed cards and folded cards, the second is that position in razz is relative, and can change in every deal, which means you have to pay attention more, and it also makes it a bit harder to keep track of actions of each players in previous rounds
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BennyLaRue
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04-03-2009, 08:38 PM
Post subject: Re: Ez Razz question
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#10 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 646
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Kijjo
I was wondering what a good winrate and what a decent winrate at razz ring games are on the micros and low stakes.
I've just been goofing around with the micros and found them really soft, was wondering what's considered good.
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The standard LHE win rates seem to be a good general guide for Stud. In other words, $0.25/$0.50 and below are frenzies, with very high win rates (5-8 BB/100) easily acheived. 2-3 BB/100 at $0.50/$1 and $1/$2 is a good, sustainable win-rate for Stud, lowering to about 1.5-2 BB/100 at $2/$4.
I've not played any higher than that. I'd suggest Razz games overall are softer, with higher win rates possible.
I see a definite difference in skill level past $1/$2 and you'll see it too if you look at Avg Players/Pot. There are fewer stud tables on any site, so get into a $2/$4 game and you'll see a greater proportion of regs than at a HE table of comparable limits.
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vlmcs
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 11
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I don't know... the problem with Razz and Stud is mostly that you need superhuman memory to play 4 or more tables. I only play them in HORSE games so I have no freakin clue what my winrate is. I try to avoid them frankly. For any single table you should be able to get a better winrate than in LHE Just because the only people who enjoy it are degenerate gamblers.
I only can play one at a time or else i certenly lose!!
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hopeful
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Flush
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 293
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I seem to find double tabling OK. I play at .50/$1, I think table selection is more important in the Stud games than elsewhere. Their are some good stud players but the majority of the players are NLHE people who are just trying it out. Inevitably they over value hands particularly in Hi/lo. Check the table out and get away from the decent stud players, if you do that win rates are much better.
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gn2056
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Long Beach, California
Posts: 36
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the best is when your playing stud hi low and razz at same time and get your tables confused. Happened to me during horse tourney i was wondering why dude was so happy to call me down with AAKK showing cost me chip lead.
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I would rather have a bottle in front of me then a frontal labotomy
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ChroNus
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Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 13
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My opinion about Razz is not very good cause i allways played usual to all of us Limited Stud or limited stud High/Low and then first time saw Razz i really thought that its an usual limited stud (like a lot of people first time playing Razz) and i was so angry when my full houses were beaten by nothing and i dont understand why.. but later i read the rools of this game and now i am beggining to like it.. 
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Vex444
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High Card
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 10
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Love when people like you show up at my table and dont know how to play. It is difficult to play more than 2 Razz HORSE Stud at once. . Lot of cards that have to be absorbed in these games. I do love these games and seem to have a good memory of what has been folded and asses the board. Badugi is another one that hard to play more than 2 at a time.
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LombardiStix
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1
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Yeah you really gotta be on your game to multitable the stud varieties. It's a great challenge and if you have the bankroll to do it, you can really bolster your memory. The only way to improve memory is to work it. When I started playing with razz I really enjoyed it as a refreshing break from the monotony of NLHE.
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FEARFACTOR
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High Card
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 12
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Razz is such a brutal game. I don't mind playing with people who know the game, but that's hard to find. Usually there are a couple of people reraising each other with garbage hands, making it too expensive to stay in even with good cards, just to get face, face, pair on 5th, 6th, and 7th. Very frustrating.
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