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jutah
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12-30-2006, 06:49 AM
Post subject: Betting overs in position?
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 82
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Hi all 
I find myself in this situation a lot. I raise pre flop later with two high cards the flop brings nothing and it is checked around to me. Should I check here or bet out? I am finding when I bet some ding dong calls call his 94o and winds of hitting the 4. If I bet the flop and again it is checked to me should I bet the turn with just to overs also? Any thoughts?
Thanks,
Jutah
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,545
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Jutah, I'll have a longer response for you tomorrow; however, it is a good practice to bet the flop if you were the last to show aggression preflop. HOWEVER, in the small stakes limit games your opponents are typically correct in calling a bet on the flop therefore you may want to wait until the turn to put a bet in which will force your opponents to play poorly. Sometimes betting the flop will allow our opponents to play perfectly, we do not want that.
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jutah
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 82
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Thanks big,
So you are thinking check the flop and if checked to again but the turn? If the turn is called are you just checking down the river if no help?
Thanks,
Jutah
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bigspenda73
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,545
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Im betting the flop probably 90% of the time if there are 2 or less players left and the board looks ragged. I will then check behind on the turn and take a free river card unimproved.
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Xanadu
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Full House
Join Date: May 2005
Location: st. paul, MO
Posts: 966
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Here's a line I take a lot heads up or 3-way against loose opponents when I have position when my overcard hand has an Ace in it (very very important for showdown value).
After raising preflop, bet the flop for value/hand protection/free card, if checked to, often raise if bet into for hand protection/ free card. If checked to again, usually bet the turn to protect hand. If anyone is still around on the river, check it down unimproved.
I take this line against players who will call with almost anything on the flop, but will usually fold the turn unless they have a pair. HU or 3-way, the flop bet is for value with an A-high overcards hand. If opponents are calling with pretty much anything, A-high is going to be ahead more than 1/3 of the time 3-way or 1/2 the time HU. Hand protection and free cards are a bonus here. On the turn, you have to decide whether to take a free card or bet again. Flop texture means a lot here. Suppose your hand is AQ, and the flop was J85 and a K comes on the turn. I tend to check behind here more when there are 2 paint cards on board because the chances of a pair being out there are so much higher than all little cards. With a less dangerous board, betting to protect your hand is good, especially since on say a 2379 board, a hand like QT will often call the turn bet hoping to hit an overcard. 2 flush and straight draw boards are also good to bet on the turn because of the increased chances a worse hand will call.
I typically check behind the river, because more often than not, a turn call means a pair or better, and although the flop and turn bets may have been +EV, a river bet is usually -EV with just A-high in these situations.
A big part of winning big in short-handed limit is knowing when to bet a mediocre hand for value. You can make a lot of money value betting A-high and small pairs, but you really have to get a feel for the right situations, and reads on opponents are a must.
One thing to keep in mind is that a bet increases in value whenever more weaker hands will call or more stronger hands will fold. If you bet in a situation where only stronger hands will call and weaker hands always fold, you are usually making a mistake. An A-high overcard hand is a good moneymaking hand in a 2 or 3 way pot when opponents will call the flop with any 2, precisely because so many weaker hands will call a bet.
Another way this line makes money is that against passive opponents, you usually get to make a bet on the end if you make your hand, but get a free showdown if you don't. This is also key to making money here.
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jutah
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 82
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Thanks Xanadu Good info that I will try
Jutah
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outphase
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 949
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here's an out-of-context reference to HEFAP. check the turn if it appears you have outs, bet it if you don't.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by lambchopdc
Lets stop talking ABC poker and move on to D, E, and F.
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