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Element187
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04-30-2005, 07:17 PM
Post subject: Bad play ?
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter
Preflop: Element187 is UTG+1 with 3 , 3 .
1 fold, Element187 calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, 4 folds, BB checks.
Flop: (3.50 SB) T, Q , 7 (3 players)
BB checks, Element187 bets, MP2 calls, BB calls.
Turn: (3.25 BB) 6 (3 players)
BB checks, Element187 checks, MP2 checks.
River: (3.25 BB) 3 (3 players)
BB bets, Element187 raises, MP2 folds, BB 3-bets, Element187 caps, BB calls.
Final Pot: 11.25 BB
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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do you normally bet on the flop with an underpair ?
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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not into 2 players...no.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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MP2 is a calling station, and BB thinks he's mistah supastah poker pro and check raises any pair.
does this change anything.
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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|~|ypermegachi
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: emo-kid
Posts: 3,580
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it doesn't matter who they are, i generally don't like betting underpairs.
in this situation, 46 out of 52 cards are scare cards...i don't like those odds 
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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The pot is microscopic and any 2 broadways have a pair or gutshot (which they will call with reguardless of pot odds, but it's not really a HORRIBLE call.) To put it another way, your hand sucks and there is no reason to get involved here. I admire your mad river skillz.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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i find im picking up alot of loose pots on tables like this.
everyone limped, i bet, everyone folds
i guess i dont see how one small bet is a waste if you might pick it up 40% of the time.
the amount of people in the pot does change things, but only 2 other villains, im not too worried.
then again i do have an ultra high aggression rating.. i have a decent sense of when im beat... the calls on my flop bet told me i was beat, so i checked along the turn.. caught my lucky 2 outer, and pillaged the idiot who slow plays and checkraises any hand.
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
I admire your mad river skillz.
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wow i get a condencending remark for my first hand post.
how would you have played this hand?
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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ArcticKnight
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Flush
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: golf course
Posts: 416
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I have been out of 10handed for a while.
I'd fold 33 pre-flop from UTG+1 on almost all tables.
In 6handed I'd raise
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Gone golfing ..see ya in the Fall of 2006
PS. What did the snail on the turtle's back say?
Wheeeeeeeee........
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ArcticKnight
I have been out of 10handed for a while.
I'd fold 33 pre-flop from UTG+1 on almost all tables.
In 6handed I'd raise
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highly passive table, nobody raises, except maybe two to 3 players might raise when they have AA KK AK
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ArcticKnight
I have been out of 10handed for a while.
I'd fold 33 pre-flop from UTG+1 on almost all tables.
In 6handed I'd raise
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I call at a full table (if the texture is loose/passive enough) and muck at a short-handed table. 55-22 play are very tough to play without a set and many good shorthanded players have said they are net losers. Hence I would only open them from the CO/Button or defend with them (figuring I lose less than my blind.)
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Element187
everyone limped, i bet, everyone folds
i guess i dont see how one small bet is a waste if you might pick it up 40% of the time.
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If you're getting away with it that often, sure go for it. I'll bet any 2 with a read. However, I don't think tweedle-dumb and tweedle-stupid fold here often enough.
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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similar type of hand.. pocket pair, over cards come
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) converter
Preflop: Element187 is SB with J, J.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, 4 folds, Element187 raises, 1 fold, UTG+1 calls.
Flop: (5 SB) A, T, Q (2 players)
Element187 bets, UTG+1 folds.
Final Pot: 3 BB
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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Element187
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 802
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i guess what im saying is, if you dont bet how do you know if your hand is good or not.
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"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Everything is different here.
o You are repping big cards via your pre-flop action
o It's heads-up to the flop
o The pot is bigger
o You have a gutshot and a Jack might be good too.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Element187
i guess what im saying is, if you dont bet how do you know if your hand is good or not.
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What I'm saying is don't bet into small pots with a weak hands against 2+ players who will often call. Against passive players, what information have you gained by betting? Their calling behavior protects them perfectly from these plays. On the other hand, they're extremely vulnerable to playing "fit or fold" in unraised pots because they're giving too much action. This is how the rocks make their money.
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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Hand 1, if you arent folding preflop you have to check/fold the flop here. EVERY card beats you here.
Hand 2, what did you expect? to yourself you have a pair of jacks but with all those broadways you are most definatly repping cards a lot higher.
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honsheung
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 153
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fold preflop
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by honsheung
fold preflop
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It's close and depends highly on the table texture. If you played 22-66 UTG every time at worst it will cost you a few cents.
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lonnie
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Full House
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 923
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Quote:
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do you normally bet on the flop with an underpair ?
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This bet is ok if you are on the button and they have all checked to you. No flush draw on the board, and they have already shown weakness. If on the button, you will probably pull a free river card too.
In EP - check/fold.
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