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Backdoor draw extravaganza

  
 
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DWDuck
Old 03-24-2005, 02:46 PM     Post subject: Backdoor draw extravaganza #1 (permalink)  
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I've been trying to learn Omaha lately... I'm certainly loving how fishy it is. Here's a fun hand I had last night. A few comments before the hand.

1. Very loose preflop call UTG... the table was EXTREMELY lose though (As you'll see), and with some decent flush and straight possibilities, I figure I'd go in. This table was lots of fun. Is this a poor preflop call, especially UTG? With the pot being 7-way I like it.

2. My call after the flop was the fun part to analyze. Did I make mistakes here? Basically I had backdoor flush and straight draws. Since I had 3 clubs, I counted the backdoor flush as a single out. A 4 or a 7 would give me an OESD, a 2 or a 9 gives me gutshot draws... so I added 2 more outs for these. With 3 outs, I figure I'd need about 15:1 pot odds to call. With a $10 pot and only $0.50 to call (20:1), I think it was a good move. Am I missing something? It felt strange calling with only backdoor draws.

3. The 4c turn was about the best I could have had. Suddenly this gives me 14 outs (nut OESD and nut flush draw). I think my turn play was suspect though. My initial check was ok (if I was going to checkraise). I think I should have raised the turn (instead of calling) with the pot equity I had. Am I correct on this?

4. What exactly did stbear23 think he had? I thought my preflop call was a little loose... this guy RAISED with 999Q!!! And then on the river reraised the whole way. Wow. Onto the buddy list you go!

Comments will be greatly appreciated. I'm still trying to learn this game. It's hard to imagine anything being fishier.

***** Hand History for Game 1784955177 *****
$0.5/$1 Omaha Hi - Thursday, March 24, 07:16:12 EDT 2005
Table Silver & Gold (Real Money)
Seat 8 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: DWDuck2 ( $53.37 )
Seat 2: stbear23 ( $18 )
Seat 3: ohguhm ( $24 )
Seat 4: KoolHandLou ( $16.5 )
Seat 5: Honken82 ( $38.5 )
Seat 6: mrmot ( $14.25 )
Seat 8: romeoshark ( $27.5 )
Seat 9: fergznreg ( $7.5 )
Seat 10: onedudemike ( $24.5 )
Seat 7: JohnnyAY ( $20 )
fergznreg posts small blind [$0.25].
onedudemike posts big blind [$0.5].
JohnnyAY posts big blind [$0.5].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to DWDuck2 [ 3s 8c Ac 6c ]
DWDuck2 calls [$0.5].
stbear23 raises [$1].
ohguhm folds.
KoolHandLou calls [$1].
Honken82 folds.
mrmot folds.
JohnnyAY calls [$0.5].
romeoshark calls [$1].
fergznreg calls [$0.75].
onedudemike calls [$0.5].
DWDuck2 calls [$0.5].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 5d, Kh, Qc ]
fergznreg checks.
onedudemike checks.
DWDuck2 checks.
stbear23 bets [$0.5].
KoolHandLou calls [$0.5].
JohnnyAY calls [$0.5].
romeoshark calls [$0.5].
fergznreg folds.
onedudemike calls [$0.5].
DWDuck2 calls [$0.5].
** Dealing Turn ** [ 4c ]
onedudemike checks.
DWDuck2 checks.
stbear23 bets [$1].
KoolHandLou folds.
JohnnyAY calls [$1].
romeoshark folds.
onedudemike calls [$1].
DWDuck2 calls [$1].
** Dealing River ** [ Tc ]
onedudemike checks.
DWDuck2 bets [$1].
stbear23 raises [$2].
JohnnyAY folds.
onedudemike folds.
DWDuck2 raises [$2].
stbear23 raises [$2].
DWDuck2 calls [$1].
stbear23 shows [ 9c, Qs, 9h, 9d ] a pair of queens.
DWDuck2 shows [ 3s, 8c, Ac, 6c ] a flush, ace high.
DWDuck2 wins $21 from the main pot with a flush, ace high.
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TLR
Old 03-27-2005, 02:41 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 I would not have called the PFR and would definitly fold on the flop

It seems like you got lucky more then anything else


 
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Fnord
Old 03-27-2005, 02:53 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Rhymes with wish...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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DWDuck
Old 03-27-2005, 11:22 PM #4 (permalink)  
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TLR, If you would fold on the flop, can you show me where my math is wrong? I mean... with 20:1 pot odds on the flop, I don't really need all that much. Thanks for the input though.

Thanks Fnord, helpful...

Darkwing
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Fnord
Old 03-28-2005, 03:07 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Cascading error. Your loose pre-flop call out of position forces you to make the thin call on the flop.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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LockLow34
Old 03-28-2005, 01:30 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I'm more of an O8 player.

Don't like the call preflop UTG with that weak of a hand. You do have good relative position throughout the hand, though, but you had no way to know that PF.

Don't like the flush redraw when holding 3 of your suit.

Jam the turn and river.

Why no re-raise with the nuts on the river? You cost yourself several bets there. After staying with the hand after the flop, you've got to get maximum value out of it.
"How deep is the money?" - Fnord
 
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Fnord
Old 03-28-2005, 01:41 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Position is 2x more important in PLO than it is in No Limit Hold'em. Something to chew on...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
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DWDuck
Old 03-28-2005, 03:33 PM #8 (permalink)  
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I'm pretty sure for some reason I wasn't able to raise again on the river here. This puzzled me too.... there should be unlimited raises since we're heads up at that point right? Perhaps I'm wrong.... but I believe the call and fold buttons were the only ones available.

The preflop calls were too loose... I've gotta fix that. I liked the flop call, but I suppose I shouldn't have been in that position. Thanks guys.

Darkwing
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