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Toasty
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03-21-2005, 02:55 PM
Post subject: For the B&M players who have read Mike Caro's Book of Te
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: England UK
Posts: 1,522
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I'll have access to live poker in around 5 months and have this book but havn't read it. I'm wondering on how much time to spend reading/re-reading this before i play live.
The casino will be new so there should be lots of fish.
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Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .
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Tripps7
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Straight
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 130
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I said a marginal edge but for me it seems somewhere between a marginal and a big edge.
I read the book a little more than a year ago and I probably need to read it again. I have picked up specific tells only a few times that I can remember, but generally I use what I learned in the book to get gut feelings from players in certain situations. Is he acting passive or agressive? Did he check his hole cards again when a third flush hit the board? Most fish don't have a clue about their body language and sometimes it's surprisingly easy to know what they have when you combine everything, (body language, betting patterns etc.)
Overall I would suggest the book to anyone, it can't hurt...
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Chicago_Kid
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Full House
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: People let me tell you about my best friends...
Posts: 1,132
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I read it a year ago, and thought it was mildly educational. However, I think the book is a bit outdated, and with poker on TV these days, many players know the standard tells and counter-tells (e.g., strong/weak reversal). Nonetheless, it provides a good framework to approach the task of obtaining tells, I just think the actual tells in the book don't exist as much anymore.
The most important lesson I've gained is that 75% of tells in average players lie in the hands. Watch those, and you can pick up information.
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"Been gone so long, forgot how to poker"
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RiverMonkey
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Flush
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 446
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I'm in the "I need to read it again camp".
I play at least 2 or 3 times per week at the B&M. I seem to rely on intuition, hand reading and observation of betting patterns & previous play to get reads much more than physical tells. Although sometimes, there are some blatent tells just sitting there screaming at you.
At my local B&M, there are more tells at the $2/4 tables than at the $4/8. That's simply because that's where all the newbies play.
I read MC'sBOTs very quickly the first day I got it. I'd say that so far it's only really given me a small edge that I've been able to exploit on a few occasions.
I have to say, I haven't seen much of "weak means strong and strong means weak". My feeling is that this concept, and tells in general are more applicable in no-limit games where bluffing is a larger part of the game.
I should and will read the book again. (after reading SSH for the 3rd time  )
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ChezJ
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Washington, D.C.
Posts: 1,456
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not to be nitpicky but this belongs in "Playing the Player" not "Limit HE"
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Chicago_Kid
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Full House
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: People let me tell you about my best friends...
Posts: 1,132
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RiverMonkey
I have to say, I haven't seen much of "weak means strong and strong means weak". My feeling is that this concept, and tells in general are more applicable in no-limit games where bluffing is a larger part of the game.
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Tru dat. I play live NL ring and this is where the "hands" thing is valuable. For limit, live or online, I just try to play TAg, and call most anything down HU...and don't let people push me around.
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"Been gone so long, forgot how to poker"
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Toasty
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: England UK
Posts: 1,522
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ChezJ
not to be nitpicky but this belongs in "Playing the Player" not "Limit HE"
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No that's deff nit picking 
I posted here as I wanted to hear from Limit Hold'em Players. There is also a lot of trafic that passes through here and I wanted a lot of oponions.
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Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Buy a copy of SuperSystem 2 and read Mike Caro's section instead.
Overall, using tells in live games takes practice.
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Toasty
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: England UK
Posts: 1,522
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Still reading the JH section atm, I'll read Caro's after, thanks for the tip.
BTW What did you think of the JH section ?
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Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Toasty
BTW What did you think of the JH section ?
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Wasn't really impressed. Too newbie oriented.
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RiverMonkey
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Flush
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 446
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Toasty
BTW What did you think of the JH section ?
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Wasn't really impressed. Too newbie oriented. |
It also seemed to be more applicable to higher stakes games. SSH is WAY better IMHO, and much more applicable to the games most of us play in.
Yeah, I like MC's section in SS2 as well .... I have to re-read it! I liked the powerpoint presentation format. One concept per slide, with a one or two pager to elaborate.
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ChezJ
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Full House
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Washington, D.C.
Posts: 1,456
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if you're trying to decide whether to buy the book, i'd say no... check out http://www.poker1.com/mcu/mculib_video.asp and watch his free videos. these are way more useful than the fuzzy black and white photos from the 1970s that are in the book (even the revised edition has these).
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