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Hornsta9

01-06-2006, 01:20 PM Post subject: Am I doing something wrong?

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jan 2006

Posts: 112

Hi all,

Im new to this forum and poker in general. Only been playing for a month or so.

I have read a lot of stategy guides online and a couple of books and followed the advice recently at Low Limit Hold'em.

I have not been having much success, mainly in part, I feel, due to people calling everything with sub standard hands and then hitting a better hand than I have by the river.

An example was that I had QQ in the pocket, in late position (playing 5c/10c limit at Pacific Poker) and someone raised pre-flop to 10c so I re-raised to 15c. Then a 3rd person re-raised to 20c and most people still called. There must have been 8 people seeing the flop.

The flop came 10 8 7 rainbow and I only had 7c left at that point and figured there is a good chance someone will hit a straight. Anyway, someone bet and another raised it to 10c and I called with my 7c, another re-raised. I was all in anyway. a couple of people folded but that left 5 in, including me. The turn and river were a 2 and a 5 rainbow so no flush and the betting continued. There was a total pot of about $2.75, quite a lot at these levels. Anyway the winner had 87 and so had two pair.

What I can't understand is that 8 people called a raise, re-raise, and re-raise pre-flop, then continued calling raises and the best hand was two pair 87? Surely if you hold 87 os pre flop you shouldn't be raising and calling re-raises?

Maybe I am missing something but I am struggling to follow the guidance I have read when premium hands seem to get beat by long odd drawing hands. I know this happens and bad beats are part of poker and just have to be dealt with but when every hand has 8 people calling the only way to win is to only play monster hands!!!

Anyway sorry for the rant, not a bad beat story really as this has happened so many times, I just want to know if the lower limit players are all maniacs and therefore cannot really be "played" against?

Any comments?

Hornsta9

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koolmoe

01-06-2006, 02:03 PM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2004

Location: Drowning in prosperity

Posts: 1,279

This should really be moved to the Beginners' Forum.

One hand does not tell the whole story. Losing with big pairs is not your problem.

There is something worse than having 8 people call four bets when you have QQ. It's raising your QQ preflop and picking up only the blinds.

What is your bankroll? Losing $10 or so at $0.05/$0.10 wouldn't be all that unusual.

Finally, sitting at a $0.05/$0.10 table with $0.27 is a bad idea.

Poker is freedom

rubixstreub

01-06-2006, 02:05 PM

#3 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: Dallas, TX

Posts: 887

First off, Welcome! You've come to a great place and with patience and practice you'll quickly see your game grow by leaps and bounds. I also commend you on focusing on limit, because I (and others in this forum) feel it's prehaps the best game for beginners to inexpensively learn the fundamentals of poker that translates well into other variations of hold'em.

You've posted a very common issue that I think everyone of us has brought up when we joined an online poker forum (whether we'll admit it or not)- "I swear I'm doing everything right, but I just can't beat these maniacs who keep pulling river wins out of their ass.")

With your specific hand, and any premium pocket pair, despite being among the very best starting hands, they lose value quickly as more people decide to play the hand. With that in mind, you have to realize just because you were blessed with a premium hand preflop, doesn't mean you have a right to win the hand (a problem a lot of beginners complain about). These play very well heads up or against 2 other opponents, but after that, be careful.

You're trying to isolate players with your preflop raise (congratulations for not thinking you can slowplay them- another very common mistake for beginners), but obviously that wont always work and you have to play the flop and remaining streets with that in mind.

The other piece of advice I would give you in these recklessly loose micro limit games is to pay very close attention to your position and the action in front of you. A good percentage of the time you'll see a majority of players limping in (I've found most people don't raise at this level because they have the mentality, "I want to see the flop first and then decide"), therefore you'll be getting wonderful odds on your drawing hands (Ace/King high flushes, suited connectors, suited one and even two gappers, as well as all low pocket pairs). These drawing hands play very well in these extremely loose/passive tables and you will pull down large pots verses the majority of calling stations.

There's so much advice out there, and I'm sure more folks will come along and add to what I've said, but keep reading, keep playing, and keep asking questions. Good luck.

Come give me advice.
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-58488.htm

Hornsta9

01-06-2006, 03:03 PM

#4 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jan 2006

Posts: 112

Quote:

Originally Posted by koolmoe

This should really be moved to the Beginners' Forum.

Sorry, I completely overlooked the Beginners forum. Can one of the moderators move it there please. Thanks

rubixstreub, thanks very much for your thorough response. I appreciate it a lot. Obviously I am learning heaps as I go by but I naively thought using the strategies and advice posted here and on other sites would put me in good stead against the other "loose" players. I need to continue reading, learning and playing.

Thanks again for your help.

Hornsta

koolmoe

01-06-2006, 03:57 PM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2004

Location: Drowning in prosperity

Posts: 1,279

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hornsta9

I naively thought using the strategies and advice posted here and on other sites would put me in good stead against the other "loose" players. I need to continue reading, learning and playing.

Just realize that all the reading and learning in the world cannot overcome the cards sometimes. Try to focus more on the decision making process and less on your big hands that got cracked. You didn't make any bad decisions in that hand.

Best of luck to you.

<edit> To be clear, it doesn't bother me a bit that you posted in this forum, but you might get more responses (and more relevant help) there. </edit>

Poker is freedom

thenonsequitur

01-06-2006, 07:22 PM

#6 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Nov 2004

Location: Location: Location

Posts: 637

Quote:

You didn't make any bad decisions in that hand.

Well, no bad decisions except for being in the hand with only a couple bets worth of chips left. Always make sure you have AT LEAST enough money to cap every street. With a 4-bet cap on every street, enough to cap all streets is 12BB. That would be $1.20 at 5c/10c. I personally like to always have at least twice that (with a 4-cap, I rebuy if I drop below about 25BB; with no cap heads-up I try to keep at least 40BB at all times for the occasional time you get the nuts vs. an opponent that will put like 10+ bets in on the turn or river with only second or even third nuts).

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