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AK TPTK against aggression

  
 
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rubixstreub
Old 08-03-2005, 02:52 AM     Post subject: AK TPTK against aggression #1 (permalink)  
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After 2,000 hands AK was still netting me negative profit so I'm already wary of this combination. How would you have bet these against this kind of aggression.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with A, K.
3 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 raises, 2 folds, Hero 3-bets, 1 fold, MP2 folds, MP3 caps, Hero calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 6, 3, K (2 players)
Hero bets, MP3 raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (7 BB) 7 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 bets, Hero calls.

River: (9 BB) Q (2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 checks.

Final Pot: 9 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has Ac Ks (one pair, kings).
MP3 has As 5d (high card, ace).
Outcome: Hero wins 9 BB.


Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with A, K.
3 folds, MP2 raises, 3 folds, Hero 3-bets, 1 fold, MP2 caps, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 6, A, 9 (2 players)
Hero bets, MP2 raises, Hero 3-bets, MP2 caps, Hero calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) 2 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets, Hero calls.

River: (10.50 BB) 9 (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 12.50 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has Ah Kc (two pair, aces and nines).
MP2 has As 2s (two pair, aces and nines).
Outcome: Hero wins 12.50 BB.
Come give me advice.
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-58488.htm
 
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|~|ypermegachi
Old 08-03-2005, 03:02 AM #2 (permalink)  
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hand 1: 3bet the flop. call down after. or bet/call down the turn.
hand 21: bet/call down the turn.
 
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KoRnholio
Old 08-03-2005, 03:29 AM #3 (permalink)  
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 Wow.. Looks like I should get back into playing Limit at Party Poker, look at those nutjobs :P
Some days it feels like I've been standing forever, waiting for the bank teller to return so I can cash in all these Sklansky Bucks.
 
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Element187
Old 08-03-2005, 03:35 AM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hypermegachi
hand 1: 3bet the flop. call down after. or bet/call down the turn.
hand 21: bet/call down the turn.
i like check raising the turn to see if he's serious on hand 1

and hand 2 same what hyper says.
"Imagine how it would be to be at the top Making cash money, Go and tour all around the world, Tell stories about all the young girls." - The Prodigy - Girls
 
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Gatlin Dan
Old 08-03-2005, 04:59 AM #5 (permalink)  
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Were both these hand at the same table? It's weird to see people capping with trash like that, even at PP .5/1. If it was the same guy, after the first time he shows that down, I give him no credit for any raisese the rest of the night. If he is capping with shit like that he is hemorrhaging money and I want it. If he is going to play like a retard, I'll leave him broke like one.

If they were not the same table and you know the guy is raising with hands that don't merit it, I will be looking two 3-bet him and get it heads up and punish him all the way to 5th street.

Whenever you see somone cap with trash like that, make a note of it. These are players you want in your game. Capping preflop with Ax screems "Take my money"

"A lot of fortunes are made on what you don't play."--"Miami" John Cernuto
 
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rubixstreub
Old 08-03-2005, 01:03 PM #6 (permalink)  
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No two, completely different idiots... PT told me they were both Stations, but even stations get delt AA once in a while.

So is it a good rule of thumb to bet TPTK through the turn regardless of action when you're heads up?

*Edit, TPTK holding AK...
Come give me advice.
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-58488.htm
 
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Gatlin Dan
Old 08-03-2005, 02:06 PM #7 (permalink)  
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If they are capping with all kinds of stuff like that, play hands that would play well against the range of hands that he would raise with. The wider that range, the more hands you should be willing to play.

These guys are seriously giving their money away. If someone will cap with A5o, he will be willing to cap with a lot of hands. He's going to have these other hands a lot more often than he will have AA or KK. Don't worry about the times he has AA or KK if he is this loose. Pay him off if he has them. You will win a lot more money against him if you keep pushing your good hands. All those bets will more than make up for any you loose when he does show down premium hands. At .5/1, you don't see people really swtiching up their speed. If he will raise with trash, he is likely to continue to do so.

As a general rule, I figure my TPTK to be good on the flop until someone plays back at me. Even if I get raised on the flop, I will still bet the turn if there are people between me and the raiser or if the raiser is last to act and there are possible draws out there. He is likely on a draw and raising for a free card. If I also get raised on the turn, that's when the critical decision of the hand is made. What could he have? Can I call this extra bet on the turn, hit one of my cards and still lose?

"A lot of fortunes are made on what you don't play."--"Miami" John Cernuto
 
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A'aag
Old 08-03-2005, 03:13 PM #8 (permalink)  
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I routinely either jam the flop and lead the turn, or bet/call the flop and c/r the turn in these situations. I won't slow down until I see some resistance on the turn or later. That's my standard play. Of course if I'm dealing with someone with a pfr of 2 or something, I probably do what you did on hand 1 because I'm hoping to split at that point. If he's one of those 40/20/5 guys, or if I've already seen him make weird plays like this, I'll jam the turn and lead the river.
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rubixstreub
Old 08-03-2005, 03:17 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatlin Dan
As a general rule, I figure my TPTK to be good on the flop until someone plays back at me. Even if I get raised on the flop, I will still bet the turn if there are people between me and the raiser or if the raiser is last to act and there are possible draws out there. He is likely on a draw and raising for a free card. If I also get raised on the turn, that's when the critical decision of the hand is made. What could he have? Can I call this extra bet on the turn, hit one of my cards and still lose?
Well from these situations it seemed highly unlikey he could be capping preflop and be on the draw, and I'd seriously doubt either of these players understand the value of a flop check raise to earn a free card. Nor do I think this type of play is typical of one player on any consistant basis... I think both instances were frustrated fish trying to play hyper aggressive to try and bluff people out of pots. Hardly a reliable read, because anyone who plays like this isn't going to be playing long.

Maybe I give people too much credit, but anyone capping preflop I read as holding AK, AA, KK, and to some extent QQ and AQ with the callers looking to hit big draws. I just feel like these guys were the exception and anytime someone caps the preflop and then flop I'm in trouble- because that tells me they're playing AA or KK with high pair or better and I'm not likely to improve.

And when do you ever fold this? AK hitting TPTK... or are you calling down possible trips, straights and flushes, if it's not heads up and callers suddenly come alive on the turn or river against draws?
Come give me advice.
http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...oker-58488.htm
 
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A'aag
Old 08-03-2005, 03:34 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rubix13
And when do you ever fold this?
Online and heads up, I need a ridiculous read and/or a ridiculous board to give this up, so basically never.
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