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AA hand; drawn out, want to know what's up.

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aleksandr

01-29-2006, 03:40 AM Post subject: AA hand; drawn out, want to know what's up.

#1 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 305

Stage #280304388: Holdem Normal $0.25/$0.50 - 2006-01-28 23:33:24 (ET)
Table: MARYLAND AVE. (Real Money) Seat #4 is the dealer
Seat 4 - LUCKYTAI ($7.10 in chips)
Seat 5 - MUSKOKA2005 ($9.60 in chips)
Seat 6 - ACESRUS ($2.90 in chips)
Seat 7 - TECHNOMANCER ($11.65 in chips)
Seat 8 - JINXIAO888 ($3.75 in chips)
Seat 9 - BIGPETE ($14.05 in chips)
Seat 1 - FOXYTRISH ($2.15 in chips)
Seat 2 - NCST8 ($28.90 in chips)
Seat 3 - LCFIREMAN ($4 in chips)
MUSKOKA2005 - Posts small blind $0.10
ACESRUS - Posts big blind $0.25
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to TECHNOMANCER [Ah As]
TECHNOMANCER - Raises $0.50 to $0.50
JINXIAO888 - Calls $0.50
BIGPETE - Calls $0.50
FOXYTRISH - Calls $0.50
NCST8 - Folds
LCFIREMAN - Folds
LUCKYTAI - Calls $0.50
MUSKOKA2005 - Calls $0.40
ACESRUS - Folds
*** FLOP *** [4c Qh 2h]
MUSKOKA2005 - Checks
TECHNOMANCER - Checks
JINXIAO888 - Checks
BIGPETE - Checks
FOXYTRISH - Checks
LUCKYTAI - Bets $0.25
MUSKOKA2005 - Folds
TECHNOMANCER - Raises $0.50 to $0.50
JINXIAO888 - Folds
BIGPETE - Calls $0.50
FOXYTRISH - Calls $0.50
LUCKYTAI - Raises $0.50 to $0.75
TECHNOMANCER - Calls $0.25
BIGPETE - Calls $0.25
FOXYTRISH - Calls $0.25
*** TURN *** [4c Qh 2h] [5h]
TECHNOMANCER - Bets $0.50
BIGPETE - Calls $0.50
FOXYTRISH - Folds
LUCKYTAI - Calls $0.50
*** RIVER *** [4c Qh 2h 5h] [Jc]
TECHNOMANCER - Bets $0.50
BIGPETE - Raises $1 to $1
LUCKYTAI - Calls $1
TECHNOMANCER - Calls $0.50
*** SHOW DOWN ***
BIGPETE - Shows [Kh 9h] (Flush, king high)
LUCKYTAI - Mucks
TECHNOMANCER - Mucks
BIGPETE Collects $10.25 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($10.75) | Rake ($0.50)
Board [4c Qh 2h 5h Jc]
Seat 1: FOXYTRISH Folded on the TURN
Seat 2: NCST8 Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 3: LCFIREMAN Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 4: LUCKYTAI (dealer) HI: [Mucked] [Qd Ad]
Seat 5: MUSKOKA2005 (small blind) Folded on the FLOP
Seat 6: ACESRUS (big blind) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 7: TECHNOMANCER HI: [Mucked] [Ah As]
Seat 8: JINXIAO888 Folded on the FLOP
Seat 9: BIGPETE won Total ($10.25) HI:($10.25) with Flush, king high [Kh 9h - P:Kh,B:Qh,P:9h,B:5h,B:2h]

Checked the flop hoping to checkraise and flush out drawing hands
Value bet turn because I picked up 4 outs to a bicycle as well, as well as a nut flush draw, as well as an overpair and 2 callers.

Pete's a fish. AQ guy I had solid dead. Any way to fix this one up?

Operation Learn to Read
Reads: 7 posted
Money: $31
SNGs: 0
MTTs: 0

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euphoricism

01-29-2006, 04:56 AM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

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A) If you raise preflop, you really have to bet the flop. The C/R tells everyone exactly what hand you have.
B) You won't get the flush draw to fold.

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elipsesjeff

01-29-2006, 05:03 AM

#3 (permalink)

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Posts: 4,900

elipsesjeff is an unknown quantity at this point

Quote:

Originally Posted by euphoricism

A) If you raise preflop, you really have to bet the flop. The C/R tells everyone exactly what hand you have.
B) You won't get the flush draw to fold.

On the Contrary, I think this hand was played perfectly, but I would have capped the flop.

Check out my videos at Grinderschool.com

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euphoricism

01-29-2006, 05:15 AM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

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I don't like c/r the whole field here on the flop because its making a massive pot for the draws. That board is seriously coordinated. Granted, with this many people, you're pretty much up shit creek (because the pots big enough that theyre all drawing anyway) and might be better off getting as much money in while youre ahead as possible.

I see your point.

I bet the flop, begging to be raised. Thats really the only way youre going to have even a remote chance of knocking some players out.

<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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euphoricism

01-29-2006, 05:17 AM

#5 (permalink)

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Meh.

I like the c/r because it was the guy closing the action that bet -- we got lucky -- this gives us a good chance of knocking people out. But what if we check and the guy immediately afterward bets, and we get 5 callers? Do you still c/r?

<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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midas06

01-29-2006, 05:20 AM

#6 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: NZ

Posts: 2,196

Why did you call the 3-bet, then lead out on the turn?

Cap that shit.

elipsesjeff

01-29-2006, 05:46 AM

#7 (permalink)

Moderator

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Location: Northern Virginia

Posts: 4,900

Quote:

Originally Posted by euphoricism

Do you still c/r?

Nope. Waiting to the turn to raise may help you here.

Check out my videos at Grinderschool.com

More Full Ring NLHE Cash videos than ANY other poker training site. Training starts at $10/month.

aleksandr

01-29-2006, 07:38 AM

#8 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 305

The pot was particularly large to begin with here, so I chose to checkraise on the flop to hopefully narrow the field and give impropper odds to draws, and also induce lesser hands (AQ/KQ/QJ/KK) to fire at the pot.

In retrospect, I should have capped the flop. I was afraid of trips, but what I should have been afraid of was a 35% draw taking away 35% of a pot that I might be heavily favored to win right now.

As far as how the day's fishing went:
My AKs in NL ring got pushed at by KTs, and he was the only guy in the ring who bought in full.
$10+1 SNG, early, I pick up AA and fire into heavy action and get called TT and QQ to pick up a permanent chip lead for first overall. (i'm 2/2 since I started playing at Absolute) BR up to $217 or so from $150. I'm going to withdraw and start bonuswhoring @$.5/1 if I hit 250.

Operation Learn to Read
Reads: 7 posted
Money: $31
SNGs: 0
MTTs: 0

euphoricism

01-29-2006, 08:27 PM

#9 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

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Quote:

Originally Posted by aleksandr

so I chose to checkraise on the flop to hopefully narrow the field and give impropper odds to draws, and also induce lesser hands (AQ/KQ/QJ/KK) to fire at the pot.

Theres a problem with that. First off, that c/r will only narrow the field IF everyone checks to the player in last position. You raise out of the blinds and get some folds.

But what about when you check, and the player immediately after you bets? C/R only gives everyone odds to draw to everything ;p

So I bet the flop, and hope to be raised so I can threebet.

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Xanadu

01-29-2006, 08:54 PM

#10 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: st. paul, MO

Posts: 966

Check out the 2 over pair hands section of SSH. Even against 2 or 3 draws, AA tends to have about a 50% pot equity on a flop like this. If the pot is too big to reasonably expect to thin the field, you must get as many bets in as possible for value. Once the person to your left bets, you must raise at every opportunity. You are value betting, not protecting your hand. This is probably the only mistake I see in this hand ... not raising the flop.

wwonka

02-01-2006, 12:30 AM

#11 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 120

cap it
bet the flop
once he caught the 4 flush he wasnt going anywhere.
not much you can do.
this happens at every level so get used to it.
with this many callersodds are that someone is going to outdraw your AA's alot.

thats why u need to make them pay to draw. those make up for when they outdraw you.

peace
wwonka

Demiparadigm

02-01-2006, 04:15 PM

#12 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Feb 2005

Location: Party 6 max

Posts: 1,602

Absolute Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.25/$0.5
9 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (9 players) Hero is UTG with A

Hero raises, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Button calls, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: 4

(13SB, 6 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Button bets, SB folds, Hero raises, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Button 3-bets, Hero calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls.

Turn: 5

(12.5BB, 4 players)
Hero bets, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, Button calls.

River: J

(15.5BB, 3 players)
Hero bets, MP1 raises, Button calls, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: 21.5BB

BEST. CONVERTER. EVER.

http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter/

To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.

midas06

02-01-2006, 11:04 PM

#13 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: NZ

Posts: 2,196

Hmm, only thing I don't like is the pot size in italics. Otherwise it's sexy.

euphoricism

02-02-2006, 12:03 AM

#14 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Your place or my place

Posts: 3,610

It can do multiple hands... sexay...

<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
Directions to join the #flopturnriver Internet Relay Chat - Come chat with us!

aleksandr

02-07-2006, 02:37 AM

#15 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 305

ooo thanks for the linky. Will use from now on.

Operation Learn to Read
Reads: 7 posted
Money: $31
SNGs: 0
MTTs: 0

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