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| Fnord |
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Commerce 9/18. My image is TAggy and I've been caught over-playing a couple hands tonight. Lukewarm table, couple soft spots. 2 limpers to me on the CO with KQo I raise, Button folds, Blinds refuse to fold, limpers call. 5BB in the pot Flop is K33r Checked to me, I bet 3 callers. 7BB in the pot. Turn is an Ace putting out 2 spades. Checked to me, I bet, BB raises, folded to me and I 3-bet.... BB is a loose and aggressive thinking player. I've seen him muck to turn raises from me before. If called, do I follow through on the river? ...or am I just spewing chips? |
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| euphoricism |
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Spewy. And overtly aggressive. Neither are good at live games  Why threebet? He'll fold a worse hand and cap a better one. Lose most, win least. Just call it down. As played, it depends on the river. Probably just check. You're beat by a lot, and don't beat much. |
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| euphoricism |
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| Bah. I dunno. The A turn is bad. I think villain shows AJ or something fairly often. Might check through turn and auto call river... | |||
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| midas06 |
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| Do you think that villain would autocall a blank river if he calls the turn 3bet? | |||
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| euphoricism |
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| So tempting to fold and find a better spot. | |||
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<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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| 6high |
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I'm having trouble finding a reason to bet the turn in the first place. I'm also having trouble calling down a raise here. The 3bet is spew. |
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| jmontis |
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Interesting add on with the "hes folded to turn raises before". He may fold a weak ace here, but i'm sure any AT or better hands are calling down. I did a similar play in a $6-12 game to a tight player with 9 high, and he was furious that i "had the nerve to 3-bet bluff" |
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take your ego out of the equation and judge the situation dispassionately
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| pokerlearner |
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"BB is a loose and aggressive thinking player" Does anyone think that villain picked up a flush draw and semi-bluff raised to make hero fold JJ-QQ by representing the A and try to make his flush even if called by hero. you guys are better at this. i am just thinking loud. If the villain was a passive, regular joe, i would put him on a better hand (he might even have the 3 being the BB). since he is LAG, i am more inclined to think he has a flush draw and wants hero to fold. |
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| 6high |
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Quote:
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| Fnord |
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Quote:
For what it's worth, my read at the table was something like 50%+ Ace 30% 3x (or better) 20% bluff (semi or otherwise) |
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| 6high |
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Quote:
Based on your %s, you should have folded to the turn c/r and been happy with the decision. You don't even have call down odds. I also think that your bluff % is too high. A thinking postflop player doesn't have a draw here that often. And when he does, he's probably freerolling you with Kx  .
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| arkitekton |
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Yup. You're puking chips here. I doubt I'd even bet the turn, let alone call the raise, LET ALONE 3-BET. If we revisit the three flop calls, I have trouble imagining that between them the pack of villains don't have at least one of: an Ace, a King, or a 3. Once the Ace hits you're very likely to be playing for at best half the pot. Worst case, obviously, is that you miss a bet from a fairly unlikely pair of pocket spades, where someone hung around with undercards and a backdoor flush draw, or from a smaller pocket pair that will pay off to a turn (and, presumably, a river) bet. Once the Ace hits though, is anyone with, say, 99, having heard you raise pf, going to call down? You have a better shot picking up a bet from them on the river after checking the turn (which may also gain if your hypothetical turn check lets someone pair an undercard on the river). I think it's a LOT more likely you're going to get check raised on this turn than you're going to get a caller with a worse hand, and you can assume anyone with an Ace will surely check raise here. All things considered, I think it's a lot more likely one of the villains has an Ace or better than having two spades (and then misses the flush draw). |
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| Fnord |
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| Would Jeff bet this turn? | |||
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| euphoricism |
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| At the risk of putting words in Jeff's uhh fingers (which I'm allowed to do because God gave me that right) he'd probably bet/fold it. | |||
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<Staxalax> Honestly, #flopturnriver is the one thing that has improved my game the most.
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| elipsesjeff |
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Quote:
Online, I'm generally calling this down except when I'm on my A++ game. I personally don't like the 3bet but I'm definately betting into this pot. In my experiences at the 10/20 Live level, even TAGs won't fold top pair and trips you're just going to get rammed into you. If called, I would probably check/behind the river unless I can see something from my opponent that would make me think he is going to fold. Also, you can muck your hands after you make him show first so he doesnt know what you have. But, you can't really fold the river at any point because the pot is pretty inflated now. Yeah, either way, I don't like the 3bet much with a splitting hand at best but hope it worked out for you. Your read as a LAG does count a lot, and if you've seen him do it before it might be worth a shot to do so. You also have to remember he is in the BB, and his calling range widens a lot. Fold to the turn checkraise and call him down next time. |
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| stingo0 |
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| I think 3 bet is a spew because weak ace is highly unlikely to fold even from the type of the player you describe. Because he will think he has a chance for a split and commited to the pot at the same time. | |||
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