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4/8 Live woes (1/2 Trip Report, 1/2 SSHE play)

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Ayodeji13

01-28-2006, 11:23 PM Post subject: 4/8 Live woes (1/2 Trip Report, 1/2 SSHE play)

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 35

Hey guys, so I went to the tropicana this weekend to try out my SSHE skillz and see if i could hang...

I initially bought in for 200 at a 4/8 table and won about 7 bets over 3-4ish hours b4 our table broke and I decided to move to another table (Note: this was my first time playing anything this high)... Things got kinda crazy when I moved to the second table

At the 2nd table in seat 1 was this LAA who probably was had a 90% VPIP and 85% PFR .

Preflop, always raised/reraised, never called.
Flop, Always bet if it was checked to him, i think he folded once when it was 3 bet b4 it got 2 him
Turn, almost never raised the turn, but almost always bet the turn if he was OOP/checked to
River, almost always checked it down, even w/the nut straight once

I think I learned a couple things from both 4/8 tables
1. I can hang at this limit, I've done enough study that I wasn't making too many mistakes post flop (i think the high stakes (atleast for me) forced me to really play my best)
2. The importance of table selection. I really had a hard time adjusting to a table where chips were flying like this and I lost like 10 bets. Most of this was due to blind play. I really lost a lot of money calling the loose raise from my big blind I think.

So my questions are, how do handle tables where chips are flying and the cost of playing has increased? My opinion is that I should just get ubersolid and switch to a rock?

---------

Thats the first part of the post, now before I left (i.e., b4 my roomate busted), I decided to play some 2/4 while he was finishing up his 1/2NL session.

When I sat down, there was this guy to my left with the pokerstars fleece and the pokerstars zipped jacket on his back with sunglasses. He was a bit short stacked and had about 10-15 bets infront of him. He was loose aggresive preflop...

The first hand when I sat down at the table there was a hand in which I asked to see another players cards at a showdown. The loose guy too my left looked at me with a disgusted look and said "dude its 2/4" ...

He then proceeded to raises blind UTG for the next 10 orbits, keeping in mind that is my big blind. I was playing tight as usual (no more than 20% VPIP) but he would always raise preflop when I limped. Dispite all this preflop aggresion he was very weak on the flop, making a lot of mistakes with bad cards OOP etc...

How do I play against some1 like this? It didn't put me on tilt as I was able to identify what he was doing. My concern was that I was losing a lot more from my blinds. Whats a good strategy for playing the blinds when your being straddled?

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Ragnar4

01-29-2006, 08:26 AM Post subject: My 2 cents

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: Billings, Montana

Posts: 1,284

Ok dude.

The way to deal with the mad cow that was raising and re-raising, and being ridiculously aggressive, is to lie in waiting and use his aggression against him.

Vorhaus talks about how to play against these kinds of players in his book "Killer Poker"

First and foremost, you do have to tighten up. A lot of drawing hands lose their luster if you're going to be paying a lot of bets to see them through, especially if his raises and re-raises are causing people to get out. Whether you want to get into an "uber rock" mode is up to you. I don't suggest it.

Premium hands, if you can isolate with a re-raise, do it. His aggression will hang him if you catch AK, AKs, KQs, and any PP. Since he's being so aggressive with so many hands, even 22 is good for getting as much money into the put through to the river. Remember. 22 is better than AKs 53% of the time. Chances are though, this dream world where you keep running him over with premium hands heads up is long gone, because he's managed to put a crowbar into everyone elses wallets and has them playing crap hands too. Which turns your PP into crap unless you catch the set on the flop and turn it into the FH by the river. Your Good ace suiteds all turn into mega gold though if you can catch a flush draw because everyone will be into the pot with speculative hands.

When you have the nuts. You actually can use this guy against himself. Everyone keeps an eye on you, and sees that you're playing tight, good hands aggressively. Meaning if you're betting... they are folding. BUT Mr. Yahoo with the betting raising disease bets out, and you go for over-calls you make soo much money. Many people will be getting into raising wars with marginal hands against this guy too. Remember this, they may do all of your checking and raising for you, you'll just let yourself get whipsawed all the way to the bank. Pure joy.

Speculative hands will need a firm commitment from the flop to go all the way. Which means that you should thin your starting hands to Suited AND connected, (Duh) but need flush and straight draws to commit to running to the river. If you've got an open ender straight draw, you'll need the flush draw, or a flush re-draw to go. If you've got a gutshot, you NEED to be on a Flush Draw. Keep in mind though, if you've got overlay, raise.

I have no idea how to deal with someone attacking your blinds. Except for the fact that if he did it 10 hands in a row, that there's no way he's raising with premium hands. IF it's just you and him, with any ace I'd re-raise and try to catch. Other than that, I can only offer this: we're all supposed to lose money out of the blinds, This is just a clear cut loss. Be glad this butthead won't be around all the time.

The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here?

Romulus141

01-29-2006, 05:00 PM

#3 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Oct 2005

Location: Oxford, PA

Posts: 118

If you have a loose guy to your left, especially if he seems to have a personal vendetta against you, you may want to just see if another table has a seat open, or try to move to his left at some point if a seat opens up there (if you can do that in a casino, I don't know since I've never been to one. I'm guessing you can but probably it is really bad ettiquette or something like that). He's making lots of mistakes, sure, but his position on you makes up for it, and makes it tough for you to profit from them (what will usually happen is that the other players at the table will profit before you do). If he was to your right, you'd be killing him.

It's not giving up or showing weakness by realizing your current seat at the table is not in your best interests. That's just good poker.

Ayodeji13

01-29-2006, 06:10 PM

#4 (permalink)

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 35

Yeah, I think I just need to remind myself to leave my ego at the door and have no shame in finding a new seat/table

Xanadu

01-29-2006, 06:33 PM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: st. paul, MO

Posts: 966

I've played quite a bit live and have never seen anyone take offense to a seat switch.

Personally, I love having a straddler at the table, and love having the total maniac, provided I can get the right seat. Over time, you should be able to get a better seat at the table.

First, the straddler. This is absolutely awesome if you can get the correct seat. The best seat when there is a guy who always straddles is third to his right. 4th to right also very good, 5th not nearly so good but still ok. The point is to be on the button when this guy is UTG. What will happen when this guy straddles is the table usually plays more loosely that hand, knowing there will be a big pot and that the raiser has a random hand. So, you sit and wait for a good hand and raise, trapping the whole table for 3bets (or often 4 as many straddlers habitually cap it) If this guy always raises his straddle, even better because you can limp and wait til everyone has put in 3 bets before you raise. Basically, you just limp in hands that give you proper pot odds, and raise your JJ, AQ,KQ, and probably ATs and KJs. You may not get a good hand, but if you do, you will be in possibly the most profitable possible preflop situation out there in limit hold-em and you will have position post flop too. If you are in the blinds when this guy straddles, or close to his left, you need to move to a better seat ASAP.

The maniac is awesome in the right situation too. Especially one as maniacal as you descsribe. I disagree with sitting to his left. If you are to his left, you will always be faced with a bet from him that basically gives no information to you, and have to either raise to thin the field, or call and hope no one raises. It is far more profitable to sit on his right and use his betting to give you information and build bigger pots when you want. You want to be as close to this guy's immediate right as possible. The idea is to tighten up somewhat preflop (you will usually be in a raised pot, so you need to play hands that will play well ... toss those small pairs and suited connectors away as well as your weaker unsuited high cards) If the super aggression preflop has opened up the table, and 7 or 8 people are seeing the flop for 2 bets, and rarely 3-betting the maniac, you can open up and play some smaller pairs and the suited connectors, as you will get the action they need post flop plus good preflop odds. Still tend to toss hands like KTo. After the flop is where the fun comes with a maniac. He's your partner, not the enemy. If he habitually raises the flop, bet your vulnerable hands so he can raise and thin the field (you will know after trying a few times if this will actually work in thinning the field ... depends on the table). If you have a very strong hand or strong draw, you use the maniac to build a pot by check-raising. Everyone has called one flop bet, so they will usually call 1 or 2 more. The only bad thing about this player at your table is unless he's running hot or has deep pockets, he won't be there long.

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