Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 35
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Quote:
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Originally Posted by angrystoc
My problem, in the .01/.02 NL games, is the opposite.
"Only a J7 beats me here, and he called a 5x pre-flop..."
Villian shows full house, jacks full of sevens. It's taken me a long time to balance between getting value on my made hands when a fish donk bets all in with middle pair, and when he's re-raising Kx that hit a wacky full house on the river. Sure it's all read based, but fish (myself included) hit the nuts too.
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Dunno if this was already highlighted, but this post is full of invalid reasoning. |
Can you elaborate? I understand that on the surface this is a very result oriented way of thinking, however I've talked myself into a lot of bad calls by eliminating weak starting hands from a players range only to find out that is exactly what they had.
My intent was to say that when my problem was not that I don't put people on ranges, it's that I do it badly at times, and against my badly guessed range I make a mathematically 'good call' that feels wrong, and ends up being wrong. I also tend to err on the side of giving people too much credit.
Here's the example I alluded to earlier (Sorry, I can't use the hand converter for a few more posts):
PokerStars Game #22916201480: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02) - 2008/12/14 15:20:55 ET
Table 'Peiroos' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: VSB.Gimli ($3.01 in chips)
Seat 2: MarcusVonRix ($1.38 in chips)
Seat 3: angrystoc ($2.21 in chips)
Seat 4: Level R1 ($4.13 in chips)
Seat 5: ijwen ($1.22 in chips)
Seat 6: hobbes54321 ($10.78 in chips)
Level R1: posts small blind $0.01
ijwen: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to angrystoc [Kc Ac]
hobbes54321: folds
VSB.Gimli: folds
MarcusVonRix: calls $0.02
angrystoc: raises $0.08 to $0.10
Level R1: folds
ijwen: folds
MarcusVonRix: calls $0.08
*** FLOP *** [Jc 7c 7s]
MarcusVonRix: checks
angrystoc: bets $0.14
MarcusVonRix: calls $0.14
*** TURN *** [Jc 7c 7s] [Qc]
MarcusVonRix: checks
angrystoc: checks
*** RIVER *** [Jc 7c 7s Qc] [4h]
MarcusVonRix: bets $0.34
angrystoc: raises $0.34 to $0.68
MarcusVonRix: raises $0.46 to $1.14 and is all-in
angrystoc: calls $0.46
Now let's look at ranges:
Preflop I'm thinking he limp-called 5x on the Button, so it's still fairly wide but we'll say {22+, A9s+, ATo+, KT+, QT+, and probably any number of SCs} (I don't really know how to get these into PokerStove).
Flop Check/Call so I'm thinking a weaker flush draw, possibly any PP or a Jack, the possibility of set is there, but if we make our draw we're still ok and JJ is a small part of his range, so we have a lot of equity. So we're looking at {22+, QJ+, and SCs}
Turn This is could be a misplay on my part, he looks scared of the flush, and I thought slow playing was the best way to get the money in. However, he checks which makes a flush less likely. My range at this point is looking like this {22+, QJ+, and SCs}
River He thinks his hand is good, but we've got the nut flush so we reraise (this probably should've been a fold/shove). He 3 bets... Hmmm, JJ? Oh well, we're priced in and have a ton of equity against weaker flushes and overpairs.
Well, he showed J7o which didn't enter my ranges at any point. I don't know how differently I would've played the hand, but I do consider it a $1.50 lesson in why you proceed with caution on paired boards when you have a FD.
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