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Blind war vs Reg

  
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 7:31am    Post subject: Blind war vs Reg Reply with quote
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Location: Walk the Walk, Flop the Flop.
Opponent is kinda TAggy and has been standing up to my steady rape of his blinds. Not sure if he had a run of hitting flops or what.

$1/$2 No Limit Holdem
PokerStars
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($72.55)
UTG+1 ($202.30)
Hero ($282.95)
BTN ($200.00)
SB ($348.80)
BB ($416.80)

Pre-flop: ($3, 6 players) Hero is CO ? ?
2 folds, Hero raises to $6, 1 fold, SB calls $5, 1 fold

Flop: Eight of Hearts Six of Spades Four of Clubs ($14, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn: Ten of Clubs ($14, 2 players)
SB bets $10, Hero raises to $50, SB calls $40

River: Six of Clubs ($114, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $76, SB calls $76

My opponent had Ace of Clubs Eight of Clubs, what do you think of his play?
What do you think I had?
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Da GOAT
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 7:53am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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your spewing AK like i would Wink

Seriously i dunno what you have BUT I would guess you have air.
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will641
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 8:01am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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i dont get his c/c on the river, but other than that i actually like it okay.

i dont really have any clue what you have. you said he had been playing back a lot, so i could see you checking back a lot of hands, including pairs. you could also have a hand like J9cc and turned the uber draw. idk. maybe you checked back 6x on the flop. given your enormous raise size and this very drawy board that makes sense.
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Irisheyes
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 8:12am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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I think you had clubs with some showdown value (K high), 79, a weak flop pair that improved on the turn, AT.

If I'm him vs you I probably c/c the turn. I've never played with you though so maybe not.
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Irisheyes
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 8:14am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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btw if you still don't have a hand on the river than I check back. Turn raise with overs or w/e would be fine but badly sized.
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will641
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 8:39am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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a river bet with AT doesnt seem all that great to me.
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Ragnar4
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 10:12am    Post subject: Re: Blind war vs Reg Reply with quote
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Location: Moscow, Idaho
Fnord wrote:
Opponent is kinda TAggy and has been standing up to my steady rape of his blinds. Not sure if he had a run of hitting flops or what.

$1/$2 No Limit Holdem
PokerStars
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG ($72.55)
UTG+1 ($202.30)
Hero ($282.95)
BTN ($200.00)
SB ($348.80)
BB ($416.80)

Pre-flop: ($3, 6 players) Hero is CO ? ?
2 folds, Hero raises to $6, 1 fold, SB calls $5, 1 fold

Flop: Eight of Hearts Six of Spades Four of Clubs ($14, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn: Ten of Clubs ($14, 2 players)
SB bets $10, Hero raises to $50, SB calls $40

River: Six of Clubs ($114, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $76, SB calls $76

My opponent had Ace of Clubs Eight of Clubs, what do you think of his play?
What do you think I had?


is this exercise for amazing cash and prizes? Because I'm still miffed about my runner up place in the last exercise.
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Ragnar4
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 10:29am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Location: Moscow, Idaho
as for my thoughts on the hand: SB Raises (possibly shoves) the turn I think is a better play than the call. Even if that pair did hit you he's got 14 outs to a winner, and I certainly think you've got fold equity here that's greater than the pot odds + his outs.

What I think you have? Your CO opening range is pretty wide I'd imagine. Any 2 wheelhouse cards, any PP, maybe even some suited connectors. like 67s +

The turn bet is what really gets me. You're repping a T like AT or KT, but the check behind on the flop only reeks of weakness until you raise the turn. Did you flop a nutstraight?

Finally a 75%~ish bet on the river, just smells like a value bet, and you either A) figgured since the flush was a backdoor flush your opponent wasn't good, or B) knew you were ahead of the flush.

I don't think I can nail it down to any one hand.

But 97s, any PP making a FH or Quads, and AT or KT are all feasible here. Listed in order from most likely, to least likely.
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Vi-Zer0Skill
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 10:44am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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9-7 is the only nut hand i could easily put in your range so i like a bet/3bet by SB as there are many more nut hands in his range.

unless he thought his MPTK had SD value and that he could get there cheaply OOP, his play stinks. also. even when he does check/shove a non pairing club river you could almost fold the second nuts since most TAGs at 200NL don't check/shove the river here without the nut flush IMO.


you could have a weaker flush, 9-7, A-10, occasionally J-J+/full house
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griffey24
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 11:50am    Post subject: Reply with quote
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I would like villain's call a lot more on a non-club river. I think clubs are a big part of your range for raisin this turn.

Your line doesn't make all that much sense, unless you slowplay a lot (57). I feel like most people would bet 79 on this flop, so I don't know if I'd put you on that.

The call on a club river is marginal (worst case scenario: very good for information on hero), and much better on a non-club river.
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 12:36pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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will641 wrote:
i dont get his c/c on the river.


Neither did I. I guess my turn line spooked him.
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griffey24
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 1:07pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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oh and I think you had QcJc, or at least some club draw that probably didn't have enough showdown value on its own to just call the turn, and hope to check down with A high or something.
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 1:10pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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griffey24 wrote:
oh and I think you had QcJc, or at least some club draw that probably didn't have enough showdown value on its own to just call the turn, and hope to check down with A high or something.


What's your river line?
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griffey24
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 1:20pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Fnord wrote:
griffey24 wrote:
oh and I think you had QcJc, or at least some club draw that probably didn't have enough showdown value on its own to just call the turn, and hope to check down with A high or something.


What's your river line?


For villain or for hero?

If I'm bluff raising this turn, then I'm always betting this river and repping the flush. (maybe check through sometimes with A high)

Villain should definitely be c/bombing this river since you rarely have a boat, and sometimes have a flush/straight.

(sidenote: one of my earlier posts made no sense, I thought he just had A8 - and was saying he shouldn't call a club river.. didn't notice till this post that he has the flush. reading abilities ftw)
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gametight
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 2:42pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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I think youve got AT, sometimes (but rarely) JJ. or some kind of a combo draw with some med. clubs on turn.

I think him calling here oop postflop is a mistake. Id rather fold or 3bet. His flat call on the river is reallly bad imo.
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 3:08pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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I had Tens.

How'd I do?
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griffey24
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 3:32pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Fnord wrote:
I had Tens.

How'd I do?


I don't think TT is strong enough of a hand to check through this flop and let cards peel. You won't know where you're at if any overcard comes.

If he's getting sick of your stealing, its even more likely he'll make a play at you on this kind of flop with hands like AJ/KQ etc, thinking you have nothing.

As played, rest is good. Surprised he didn't shove.. guess he's lucky Razz
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IowaSkinsFan
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 3:46pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Almost as bad as that idiot redgrape
Almost as bad as that idiot redgrape

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Opp played it fine besides calling river. I'd prob raise turn if i was him but calling is fine
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 3:56pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Yeah my thoughts after this hand went down was how the fuck didn't I stack him. I thought about a bunch of different river bet sizes and I thought the pot was just a bit too small to push plus my WTF turn bet might get him to look me up light on a pretty scary river against his range. check/call is such a terrible line with the Ace flush.
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Irisheyes
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 4:37pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Fnord wrote:
I had Tens.

How'd I do?


Given the read why not bet/call the flop and not fold?
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 4:42pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Irisheyes wrote:
Given the read why not bet/call the flop and not fold?


Because I'm a showdown monkey and sometimes in the unlimited hold'them we mix up our play, particularly when the pot is small.
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dsaxton
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 4:48pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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His play is pretty bad. He's calling your turn raise on the basis of implied odds, but if he knows you're a competent tagg, he should recognize that you would've bet the flop with any strong hand, which means your turn raise is usually a weak hand or a bluff, so his implied odds don't exist. He'd actually be better off reraising as a semi-bluff than calling and trying to make his hand.

I think the actual results here are pretty misleading.
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Fnord
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 5:20pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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dsaxton wrote:
if he knows you're a competent tagg.


I play bad.
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Irisheyes
Post Posted: Tue, 08 Jul 2008, 5:53pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Fnord wrote:
Irisheyes wrote:
Given the read why not bet/call the flop and not fold?


Because I'm a showdown monkey and sometimes in the unlimited hold'them we mix up our play, particularly when the pot is small.


Cool. Personally when I have reads I like to mix up my play in ways which will cause my opponents to make the biggest mistakes possible.
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