Very low limit strategy? Supertight not working!

All right, I know Hellmuth has been under fire for his play style as stated in "Play Poker Like the Pros" but I didn't know this before I started playing his supertight strategy at the 0.5/1 tables.

For those who don't know this is where you only play AA, KK, QQ, AK, AQ, JJ, 10-10, 9-9, 8-8, 7-7. You bet very agressively to protect your hand. The problem is that on the 0.5/1 tables the if I make a bet at the flop it usually maxes out right there. I can't muscle people out of the hand with 50 cents!

Well, when I first started the supertight I made 60BB in 6 hours and then in a few days lost 120BB. This is a massive swing and I don't dare attribute it to bad luck without asking some more experienced players.

Also I'm thinking I should be seeing more flops because I can never 3-bet preflop because noone raises. Therefore it's cheap to see the flop with worse hands and fold if it doesn't hit.

Well, I guess what I am asking is what you guys think about player supertight in 0.5/1 and if not good what you think would be an optimal strategy for it. I don't want to move up a limit or onto no limit, I want to figure this out first. I consider myself I decent poker player and probably have played near 10,000 hands online.

Its pretty simple: Thats just not a good limit strategy. You can't expect to chase people out of the pot preflop - the best you can do is get value for your hands. Playing 10,000 hands isnt exactly a monumental achievement - I play that many hands in less than a month 2-3 tabling.

The most pivotal thing you need to learn is that sound preflop strategy is nothing without a good postflop game... and by that, I DONT mean knowing when to fold hands. I could go on for pages about all the strategies and math that you need to learn but Ill save myself the time and let the real pro's explain it.

I suggest you go out and buy Small Stakes Hold 'Em: Winning Big With Expert Play By Ed Miller (Sklansky and Malmuth) once you have got the basics of low limit poker down. If you need help getting started - Winning Low Limit Hold 'Em by Lee Jones seems to be the popular choice for most beginner players.

The hallmark trait of a profitable poker player is experience. Play as much as you can and apply everything you learn as much as you can - use these forums as a critiquing tool of your play. Post histories and questions - its the only way youre going to correct whatever it is youre doing wrong.

Bottom Line: Anyone can wait for AA - 77 in poker and play them - that doesn't make them a good poker player nor does it make it a profitable strategy. If you could make money doing just that, wouldn't everyone be a professional poker player?

*Last edited by Fnord on Thu, 30 Dec 2004, 3:57am; edited 1 time in total*

I have no idea what posessed Phil to write that. Word is he's an online cash game whale. Most players play too many hands and go too far with them. But in this case the cure isn't much better than the disease.

I hear AJs, ATs, KQs, KJs, QJs are all pretty good hands. Reach out to your inner LAgg and give 'em a try. Go crazy and limp in 66-22, A9s, A8s, KTs, QTs, JTs too.

in gigantic multiway pots, which are typical in very low limit HE, you can't really expect one pair to hold up on the river very often, even if it's AA. for me, the most profitable hands in super loose passive games tend to be suited aces and kings. especially AQs, KQs, and KJs, but I've also won a lot this week with K9s and A6s.

i skimmed hellmuth's book last year and the impression i got was that it was geared towards higher stakes players (hence the "pros" in the title). i don't think there was much in there that would apply to a typical super loose low stakes game.

check out lowlimitholdem.com for a good intro to the game, then once you master it and want to accelerate your profits, pick up small stakes holdem as stevie recommended. but i don't recommend reading SSH first.

ChezJ

In the lower limits you are going to get a majority of your profits from flushes , straights, and sets.

Play a lot of pocket pairs, suited connectors, and suited Aces, and you'll do pretty well. TPTK does hold up the majority of the time, although it doesnt look like it. Don't get discouraged.

i think just playing those 10 hands works for NL. after all, you can camp on aces or kings and get paid off, because those people are stupid and don't notice you haven't played a single hand for 20 minutes.

limit, this is a losing strategy. open up your starting hand requirements. just remember, the more opponents you face on average, the BETTER hands you need to beat them.

aces and kings are destroyed in limit all the time (but also win their fair share of the time) because they are facing against like 4 or 5 different opponents. on a coordinated board you can be almost sure someone has you beat by the river 50% of the time.

lower pocket pairs, suited connectors, suited aces, those are all strong hands because you hit sets (which are consealed), hit straights, and hit flushes which are all strong enough to win against multiple opponents.

this week i played $3/$6 in arizona for a total of 18 hours and won 4 or 5 $100+ pots with A-high or K-high flushes. AA and KK have been net losers this week. short term results, i know. i certainly agree they are profitable in the long run. i'm just saying, you are going to get suited aces and kings far more often than pocket aces or kings, and not playing them is a humongous error in a limit situation. hellmuth is just plain wrong to not include them in his starting hand recommendations. they are IMMENSELY profitable.

against a barrel of fish who play any ace-rag, i'm even playing A9o from LP if the pot is shorthanded. you gotta loosen up a little or you'll let too many opportunities slip away.

ChezJ

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Very low limit strategy? Supertight not working!

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Very low limit strategy? Supertight not working!