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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 12:35pm Post subject: this was awkward... |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 1555
WPP: 84
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BB is usually loose/passive, but i've seen him pull an all in double barrel semi bluff before.
Ultimate Bet No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)
MP ($424.10)
Button ($376)
SB ($629.65)
BB ($208.70)
Hero ($411.90)
Preflop: Hero is UTG with 8 , J.
Hero raises to $14, 2 folds, SB calls $12, BB calls $10.
Flop: ($42) 6 , 7, 8 (3 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $32, SB folds, BB calls $32.
Turn: ($106) 2 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero...
BB just has $163 left. i bet, but wasnt sure of the amount, and if i want to call a c/r. |
Last edited by benny999 on Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 1:19pm; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 12:46pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 1782
WPP: 101
Location: Toronto'ish
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I agree this line is weird... but i just cant call here.
If you had better reads, its possible, but without anything solid I fold here. |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 1:21pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 1555
WPP: 84
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i guess it looked like he shoved the turn, but i edited - it was just checked to me.
i was thinking either check behind, bet smallish (call a push?), or bet big and call a push. |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 1:25pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 1948
WPP: 55
Location: Dizzy
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 2:04pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 3580
WPP: 79
Location: emo-kid
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| sauce123 wrote: | | 90 call shove |
really? you're comfortable stacking off TPGK vs a loose passive? |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 2:39pm Post subject: |
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Almost as bad as that idiot redgrape
Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 5992
WPP: 74
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| I can't see us not betting here and there's no way we're folding to a minraise shove so yeah. |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 3:54pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 20 Dec 2005
Posts: 3236
WPP: 86
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| i d bet pot and call a shove |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 4:00pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 3580
WPP: 79
Location: emo-kid
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| what's wrong with checking behind? besides giving a free card? |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 6:04pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 20 Dec 2005
Posts: 3236
WPP: 86
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| |~|ypermegachi wrote: | | what's wrong with checking behind? besides giving a free card? | giving a free card isn't great since soooo many cards can help villain's range
if board was dry it'd be ok but so much of villain's range is pair + str8 draw and 9x which all have 10ish+ outs vs our hand
also, at this point I'd say pot is big enough to be worth protecting. |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 6:48pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Posts: 1948
WPP: 55
Location: Dizzy
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| hyper- if we check behind its wit the intention of folding to any bet on almost any river... so giving up basically |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 7:33pm Post subject: |
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Almost as bad as that idiot heybude
Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 2688
WPP: 72
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| why would we check? tons of worse hands call lets not be a nit. |
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Posted: Thu, 28 Jun 2007, 9:06pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 1555
WPP: 84
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| i guess this was fine then - i bet $75 intending to call a push, and after a few seconds, they folded. |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 12:15am Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 20 Dec 2005
Posts: 3236
WPP: 86
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 1:57am Post subject: |
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Full House
Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Posts: 860
WPP: 92
Location: Deventer
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 6:02am Post subject: |
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Flush
Joined: 02 Jun 2006
Posts: 390
WPP: 117
Location: London
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Well Played...
I'm a wimp though, I check behind, I'm not risking 50bb's on tpgk vs a loose passive when I can wait to value bet stronger.
(When top pair is an 8 on a 678 board.) |
Last edited by noble007 on Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 6:05am; edited 2 times in total
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 6:02am Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 1782
WPP: 101
Location: Toronto'ish
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| benny999 wrote: | | i guess this was fine then - i bet $75 intending to call a push, and after a few seconds, they folded. |
Does this hand playout the same or differently if he check-raises the flop. You still willing to stack off here? |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 9:49am Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 3000
WPP: 92
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| minSim wrote: | | Who else pots the flop? |
not me. I dont want to build it too much when there are so many scarecards that can come. 3/4 is strong enough and gets enough value but still keeps the pot a reasonable size. |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 11:17am Post subject: |
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Full House
Joined: 18 Oct 2006
Posts: 1250
WPP: 105
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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if your plan on turn blank with a draw heavy board is to check Hyper, you might as well open-fold on the flop.
Definitely a weird spot. I think 90/callshove is fine. I probably fold j8s pf in that position though. I would play it in CO.
Lots of people will call a flop bet if they caught a piece, thinking original raiser probably missed not putting benny on top pair. So we have to bet turn here, lots of hands call flop even with nothing. |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 12:18pm Post subject: |
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Full House
Joined: 29 Mar 2007
Posts: 860
WPP: 92
Location: Deventer
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| Pelion wrote: | | minSim wrote: | | Who else pots the flop? |
not me. I dont want to build it too much when there are so many scarecards that can come. 3/4 is strong enough and gets enough value but still keeps the pot a reasonable size. |
I think hero is more often ahead here then behind and a potsized bet is called just as often as a 3/4 bet. Therefor I'd pot it. Like to hear more thoughts why it is bad though. |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 7:26pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 3000
WPP: 92
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| minSim wrote: | | Pelion wrote: | | minSim wrote: | | Who else pots the flop? |
not me. I dont want to build it too much when there are so many scarecards that can come. 3/4 is strong enough and gets enough value but still keeps the pot a reasonable size. |
I think hero is more often ahead here then behind and a potsized bet is called just as often as a 3/4 bet. Therefor I'd pot it. Like to hear more thoughts why it is bad though. |
Its not just about being ahead though. Its about being ahead and being playable. Being ahead now and betting before giving up on a card that missed both of us sucks alot. Being in position protects us from most of this but we can still check behind on the turn and then face a tough river bet OR be forced to make a turn bet of our own that we arent really happy with. I dont particularly want to play a big pot with this hand so I wont go out of my way to build one. |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 10:46pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 1555
WPP: 84
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| griffey24 wrote: | | benny999 wrote: | | i guess this was fine then - i bet $75 intending to call a push, and after a few seconds, they folded. |
Does this hand playout the same or differently if he check-raises the flop. You still willing to stack off here? |
that'd be tough. good chance id call an all in c/r but fold to a small one...but folding to any c/r is prob best. |
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Posted: Fri, 29 Jun 2007, 10:48pm Post subject: |
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 1555
WPP: 84
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pelion good point. makes me think how this all started pre flop.
i forget why i raised, its not like standard utg for me... |
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Posted: Sat, 30 Jun 2007, 4:19pm Post subject: |
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Full House
Joined: 18 Oct 2006
Posts: 1250
WPP: 105
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
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yeah, thats the problem with raising with a lot of players behind you with an awkward hand like j8. I would have just dumped it. I would waise J8, but only in CO or button.
I like pelion's advice, pot control with a marginal hand is important, no sense in bloating to the point where we have to call a push with top pair and an 8 kicker. |
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