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Posted: Fri, 31 Mar 2006, 9:23pm Post subject: betting with worst hand = good?
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Flush
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 359
WPP: 85
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this is just shameless self-promotion. i love this hand!
1. i think it was played correctly on all streets so that i didnt need to worry about cashing in on my implied odds? or do you think i need to be raising this river to ensure long-term profit?
2. also, what is your turn play when you pick up outs like this in a multi-way passive pot in posn? take the free card? (imo taking the free card is actually a mistake strictly by the probabilites of making my hand with sf draw vs this many opps. Ie if its correct to call 2:1, SURely its correct to bet out 5:1?)
3. i miss the river, and the same 20$ bet is to me. my play? im pretty sure i fold it.
Poker Room skin
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $1/$2
9 players
Converter
Stack sizes:
UTG: $67
UTG+1: $216
MP1: $133.40
MP2: $189.20
MP3: $100
CO: $40.60
siknd: $224
SB: $196
BB: $273
Pre-flop: (9 players) siknd is Button with 3 5
2 folds, MP1 calls $2 (pot was $3), 2 folds, CO calls $2 (pot was $5), siknd calls $2 (pot was $7), SB calls $1 (pot was $9), BB checks.
Flop: 2 4 Q ($10, 5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, CO checks, siknd bets $5, SB folds, BB calls $5 (pot was $15), MP1 calls $5 (pot was $20), CO calls $5 (pot was $25).
Turn: T ($30, 4 players)
BB checks, MP1 checks, CO checks, siknd bets $15, BB calls $15 (pot was $45), MP1 calls $15 (pot was $60), CO folds.
River: 8 ($75, 3 players)
BB checks, MP1 bets $20, siknd calls $20 (pot was $95), BB folds.
Results:
Final pot: $115
MP1 has KD10C
siknd has 3D5D |
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 12:34am Post subject:
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 2195
WPP: 52
Location: NZ
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| I wouldn't raise this river. Passive player suddenly donking 5th street starts alarms. I don't see any other play on the river that doesn't involve folding if you miss your draw and are bet into. |
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 2:27am Post subject:
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Full House
Joined: 02 Jun 2005
Posts: 908
WPP: 50
Location: Massachusetts
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| Dude that guy pulled the most incredible donk bet I have seen ina while.Wow. |
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 2:47am Post subject:
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Full House
Joined: 12 Dec 2004
Posts: 1296
WPP: 54
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flop isn't bad, I definitely slow down on the turn though, I'd rather check raise a large amount than just bluff out into a field of players.
Raise that river you pansy  If he has a bigger flush, pay it off and say nh. The reason why is you showed aggression earlier in the hand and he's very likely to pay off a large bet with a worse hand. |
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 7:48am Post subject:
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Flush
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 359
WPP: 85
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| Quote: | | flop isn't bad, I definitely slow down on the turn though, I'd rather check raise a large amount than just bluff out into a field of players. |
1. i dont consider this a bluff. im really trying to 'value bet' here, on the come. thus the subject line. a bluff would need to be at least full pot?
2. the only problem with this turn bet is that ive actively decided to build the pot, its designed to get as many callers possible. when betting with a drawing hand, do you feel that you should always give your opponents the opportunity to fold by betting more, ie more semi-bluff and less value bet?
3. i built the pot nicely here. how silly do i feel if i check the turn, catch my card and win a nothing pot? a straight-flush draw is really a pretty solid 'hand'.
4. i feel pretty safe betting out into several players. headsup im tempted to check behind. firstly id be very afraid of being trap CRd all in (less of a threat in a multi-pot?), but also id be getting poorer odds by having fewer players to call my bet.
5. i cant checkraise, im button.
| Quote: | | Raise that river you pansy If he has a bigger flush, pay it off and say nh. The reason why is you showed aggression earlier in the hand and he's very likely to pay off a large bet with a worse hand. |
1. on one hand i agree here. the reason i make point 2 above, is because i feel that all my 15 outs are clean, ie will give me the 'nut' hand, even the flush. i also am very aware that he will have a hard time believing that i made a runner-runner flush while betting every street.
2. however, im mostly with midas on this one. i mean, i have NO definition of this persons hand. if i find out he was slowplaying a set the whole time, i would be pretty pissed at myself for not stacking him. but theres just no way to tell. as it turns out in this hand, he folding to anything but perhaps a minraise. this board needed more paint for me to continue aggression on the river. it was so raggy i couldnt really put him on a hand i felt 100% safe in raising. |
Last edited by siknd on Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 8:14am; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 8:13am Post subject:
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Flush
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 359
WPP: 85
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| Quote: | Ie if its correct to call 2:1, SURely its correct to bet out 5:1?
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this statement is not quite correct. im probably not quite as good as 2:1 multi-way. and by betting 15 into 30 i would be getting 3:1 with one caller. with two callers i effectively get 4:1, ie my 15 into 60. |
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 11:30am Post subject:
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Full House
Joined: 02 Mar 2005
Posts: 883
WPP: 85
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On a different board, I'd raise the river.
There's no obvious straight there, we have a very low flush. I don't like a raise here.
We might get paid by two pair, though. |
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Posted: Sat, 01 Apr 2006, 3:04pm Post subject:
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Full House
Joined: 12 Dec 2004
Posts: 1296
WPP: 54
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| I just think it's crazy to bet the whole way with nothing, then simply call a bet after we make a very strong hand that is best here more often than not. |
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Posted: Sun, 02 Apr 2006, 6:46am Post subject:
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Royal Flush
Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 17649
WPP: 83
Location: Walk the Walk, Flop the Flop.
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| I don't like the turn bet. I see no reason to think 3 other players are folding, so take your free card. |
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Posted: Sun, 02 Apr 2006, 8:44am Post subject:
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Flush
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 359
WPP: 85
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| Fnord wrote: | | I don't like the turn bet. I see no reason to think 3 other players are folding, so take your free card. | i dont want them to fold, do you see why? (i just dont want them to raise)
okay, heres a question then: how much would you bet out if i had top pair instead of a draw? |
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