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Posted: Sat, 31 Oct 2009, 5:27pm Post subject: deep in tourney- pushing as short stack
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Flush
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
Posts: 368
WPP: 214
Location: Stackton
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I don't know if I played these hands too passively. The Hand 1 and Hand 2 occured in succession and with the same villian. He was running 17/8. I don't know if I should have pushed any of them.
Hand 1
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 1.1 Tournament, 1250/2500 Blinds 250 Ante (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
BB (t56262)
UTG (t150065)
UTG+1 (t123039)
MP1 (t60766)
MP2 (t84540)
MP3 (t123790)
CO (t136856)
Hero (Button) (t54995)
SB (t62680)
Hero's M: 9.17
Preflop: Hero is Button with 9 , 9
3 folds, MP2 bets t10000, 5 folds
Total pot: t8500
Hand 2
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 1.1 Tournament, 1250/2500 Blinds 250 Ante (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
SB (t53512)
BB (t149815)
UTG (t122789)
UTG+1 (t60516)
MP1 (t90290)
MP2 (t123540)
MP3 (t136606)
Hero (CO) (t54745)
Button (t61180)
Hero's M: 9.12
Preflop: Hero is CO with Q , A
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t2500, MP1 bets t10000, 7 folds
Total pot: t11000
Hand 3
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 1.1 Tournament, 2000/4000 Blinds 400 Ante (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
MP3 (t363995)
CO (t44181)
Button (t76210)
SB (t106875)
BB (t414919)
Hero (UTG) (t59790)
UTG+1 (t74849)
MP1 (t176089)
MP2 (t191299)
Hero's M: 6.23
Preflop: Hero is UTG with 4, 4
push or fold? |
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Posted: Sat, 31 Oct 2009, 5:42pm Post subject:
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Flush
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 594
WPP: 114
Location: Montreal, Canada
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| imo the first two are shoves (2nd a bit closer than first) and the 3rd is a fold. First two you have f/e and can get called by worse and 3rd one even though your M is small you're utg and crushed a lot. I'm interested to see what actual MTT ppl think. |
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Posted: Sat, 31 Oct 2009, 6:06pm Post subject:
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Straight Flush
Joined: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 7972
WPP: 67
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1/2 I would shove both quickly
hand 3 I would fold but shove isn't bad, chart says 66+ |
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Posted: Sun, 01 Nov 2009, 11:28pm Post subject:
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Full House
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 929
WPP: 113
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| Yeah I think its pretty hard to make a good argument for folding 1 and 2. 3 is a fold, there are better spots for a 15bb stack. |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 2:04am Post subject:
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4-of-a-Kind
Joined: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2096
WPP: 101
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what they said ^^
You often won't have much of an advantage if called in hands 1-2, but you'll sometimes get villain to fold preflop and increase your stack by 30% !!
99 is 54% vs a really tight range of 88+ AJo+ KQ
AQs is 50% vs the same range |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 3:47am Post subject:
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Straight
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 247
WPP: 81
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equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 55.046% 54.35% 00.70% 541597704 6972426.00 { 88+, ATs+, KJs+, AJo+ }
Hand 1: 44.954% 44.25% 00.70% 441018372 6972426.00 { 99
Looks like 99 is not a favourtie. But does the fold equity make up for it? It seems like he is never folding TT+, folding weak part of his range. |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 4:29am Post subject:
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Flush
Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 594
WPP: 114
Location: Montreal, Canada
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| i think f/e DEF makes up for it because of how much shipping that pot PF does for your stack. The 99 shoves seems the easiest of the three because there are more combos of AK/AQ etc.. (though I guess there are more combos of 10s, jj, qq etc but whatever shove!) But yeah also in the AQ hand the guy is punishing a limper which generally means his range is a bit tighter whereas 99 is an open raise so more often air. |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 4:02pm Post subject:
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Straight
Joined: 12 Jan 2005
Posts: 124
WPP: 244
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada
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| sk8r_daniel wrote: | equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 55.046% 54.35% 00.70% 541597704 6972426.00 { 88+, ATs+, KJs+, AJo+ }
Hand 1: 44.954% 44.25% 00.70% 441018372 6972426.00 { 99
Looks like 99 is not a favourtie. But does the fold equity make up for it? It seems like he is never folding TT+, folding weak part of his range. |
I'm not crazy about the range you set; ATs and KJs should not be calling here. But hey, it's a 1.1 tourney so anything's possible. |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 4:03pm Post subject:
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Straight
Joined: 12 Jan 2005
Posts: 124
WPP: 244
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada
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And yes, I push hands 1 and 2 without thinking much of it
Hand 3 is a quick fold UTG |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 4:25pm Post subject:
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Flush
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
Posts: 368
WPP: 214
Location: Stackton
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Aren't we pushing 1 and 2 regardless of the stakes we are playing and of excluding ATs and KJs?
How would you guys play these hands against a player running let's say 10/4? I don't know everyone thought about the stats because nobody mentioned about it. |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 4:32pm Post subject:
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Straight
Joined: 12 Jan 2005
Posts: 124
WPP: 244
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada
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| Extremophile wrote: | Aren't we pushing 1 and 2 regardless of the stakes we are playing and of excluding ATs and KJs?
How would you guys play these hands against a player running let's say 10/4? I don't know everyone thought about the stats because nobody mentioned about it. |
1: Yes, I would think so anyway. Excluding ATs and KJs just makes our decision easier, and it is a fair assumption.
2: I'd be concerned about sample size first and foremost. Even if it was large enough, he could be getting desperate or just trying to capitalize on his tight image. Either way I think he is folding back often enough to justify our move.
Drmcboy or someone better than I should clarify imo  |
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Posted: Mon, 02 Nov 2009, 9:45pm Post subject:
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Full House
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 929
WPP: 113
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| Extremophile wrote: | Aren't we pushing 1 and 2 regardless of the stakes we are playing and of excluding ATs and KJs?
How would you guys play these hands against a player running let's say 10/4? I don't know everyone thought about the stats because nobody mentioned about it. |
I think the type of player matters more than the stakes. Vs a 10/4 I would almost always fold the AQ situation if its over a decent # of hands. The 99 situation is just an open so this can be a little bit of a wider range. Plus you would have FE against that type of player so I think a shove would be fine. |
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Posted: Tue, 17 Nov 2009, 10:04pm Post subject:
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3-of-a-Kind
Joined: 28 Jul 2005
Posts: 92
WPP: 110
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Shove 1 and 2
Fold on 3 unless i have favourable reads and chip stacks are small. |
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